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Discussions => Instrument Makes and Models => Topic started by: 911377brian on January 12, 2015, 05:11:57 PM

Title: Bandonika.
Post by: 911377brian on January 12, 2015, 05:11:57 PM
Received the Meinel & Herold bandonika today, purchased from John Spiers recent clear out. I'm very pleased with its overall condition and have spent most of this afternoon attempting to play it.The air lever on the right is less of a problem than I thought it would be, but bellows control needs some practice. The German players on You Tube make it look easy......It will probably benefit from a seeing to by Microbot of this parish as it is certainly playable but a little muffled compared with my one rows. Perhaps it's meant to be? It weighs in at 8 1/2lb, not a problem as it sits on both thighs. Any tips on playing the brute will be gratefully received. I think we will become chums over time....I'm very glad I bought it. Thanks Squeezy.. New emoticon for happy bandonika players please Mods...... :||: :Ph
Title: Re: Bandonika.
Post by: pikey on January 12, 2015, 10:56:39 PM
We could form the Bandonika Brothers  >:E
Title: Re: Bandonika.
Post by: 911377brian on January 13, 2015, 08:00:54 AM
Did'nt know you had one Pikey...any tips? ???
Title: Re: Bandonika.
Post by: oggiesnr on January 13, 2015, 08:13:32 AM
On fast tunes move the bellows with the emphasis on your strong arm rather than both equally.  Cross rowing makes a LOT of sense.

Have fun

Steve
Title: Re: Bandonika.
Post by: 911377brian on January 13, 2015, 09:21:57 AM
Thanks Steve, so now I have to venture into the dark world of cross rowing ! As I've never played anything but one row that should be interesting. I suppose that means finding the same note on the top row to keep moving the bellows in the same direction to keep things moving smoothly? Badly worded but the best I can do.....
Title: Re: Bandonika.
Post by: Chris Ryall on January 13, 2015, 09:42:28 AM
I read somewhere that tangos (which tend to hang in harmonic tension with a line of dominants of dominants) are played on bandonèon 90% on the pull, presumably closing the bellows as the chords resolve. So yes, cross rowing. A real journey, but worth it.

Start by learning the underlying pull scales, yes they can be dull. After a bit of practice you'll perceive them as invisible lines of music across rhe right end. Then you can pick out whatever note you need from them, as the moment takes you.
Title: Re: Bandonika.
Post by: 911377brian on January 13, 2015, 10:46:18 AM
I'm much obliged to you all ....the journey begins..... :||: :Ph
Title: Re: Bandonika.
Post by: Rob2Hook on January 13, 2015, 12:44:48 PM
The sound and appearance of a bandonika should be similar to a bandonion, but the rest is pure melodeon.  I hope you have big hands as I find the German square boxes just too big for my rather lady like, small hands (though a slightly pudgy lady...).  Having large section bellows, the instrument is never going to be shrill in tone and most, if not all, have a casotto chamber on the left hand resulting in a rather nasal muted tone - but that does stop the basses overpowering the melody.  I suspect that a M&H instrument is not going to have the power and tone of a Alfred Arnold, just as their Club boxes come second to Hohners of the same period, but a fettling may bring surprising results!

Sadly, in our D/G biased UK scene any bandonika is likely to be a solo instrument.  That's a shame as if you can play in the keys others are it would bring a novel tonal variation to any group.

Rob.
Title: Re: Bandonika.
Post by: 911377brian on January 13, 2015, 01:26:02 PM
I thought my hands were quite big Rob, but it's still a stretch for me..it's quite clear from the wear around the bass buttons that most owners over the century or so since it's manufacture have only used the two nearest buttons out of the eight available, handy as they go with the F row. I bet Squeezy used them all! Getting to all the buttons does involve moving the hands around a bit, so getting the straps right seems important..
Title: Re: Bandonika.
Post by: oggiesnr on January 13, 2015, 04:38:37 PM
BTW do NOT get tempted to use a neck strap, all it will do is kill your neck!

If you want to play standing up then use two straps and use them as shoulder straps.  I still don't recommend it but it's a better option.

As far as reaching the chord button is concerned.  As the air button is on the right there is nothing to stop you putting your thumb through the strap rather than on the outside and this buys you some extra reach.

The trick with cross rowing a bandonika is to look for what I call "triples" so C/D/E for example.  If you can cross row that middle note then that's two bellows changes you've eliminated.  The long sequences of pull notes that you can get on a bandoneon don't really apply here as a bandonika is a totally different beastie and isn't chromatic in the way a bandoneon is.  Playing triples will let you keep that push/pull element there (and keep in sync with your basses) but reduce wear and tear on your wrists and shoulders.

Steve
Title: Re: Bandonika.
Post by: 911377brian on January 13, 2015, 04:47:22 PM
All the tips I've received have been useful and I've tried them out as they have come in.Stuffing my thumb under the strap on the bass side has proved particularly useful Steve...
Title: Re: Bandonika.
Post by: Sebastian on January 13, 2015, 09:15:09 PM
I read somewhere that tangos (which tend to hang in harmonic tension with a line of dominants of dominants) are played on bandonèon 90% on the pull, presumably closing the bellows as the chords resolve. So yes, cross rowing. A real journey, but worth it.
:-X
Title: Re: Bandonika.
Post by: gettabettabox on January 14, 2015, 12:52:24 AM
if you get to grips with this apparatus and subsequently ''drawn'' in, (may your god have mercy upon your soul,) then it might be interesting to attend a milonga dance. (kind of social tango? ha!) assuming you're in the uk, there are quite a few held, linked often to modern jive events. - no need to dance, just watch. (don't cost a fortune...£10ish)
as with any musical dance genre, it's great to see people moving to it.
Title: Re: Bandonika.
Post by: pikey on January 14, 2015, 10:18:23 PM
What Steve said, plus let it play German folk tunes !  :||:
Title: Re: Bandonika.
Post by: 911377brian on January 15, 2015, 08:53:15 AM
That's interesting Pikey, it seems impossible to play anything quickly on the brute; I'm assuming that German folk tunes would be of a more stately tempo than say the Trumpet Hornpipe.... :||: :Ph
Title: Re: Bandonika.
Post by: oggiesnr on January 15, 2015, 10:06:14 AM
That's interesting Pikey, it seems impossible to play anything quickly on the brute; I'm assuming that German folk tunes would be of a more stately tempo than say the Trumpet Hornpipe.... :||: :Ph

It should play at a reasonable speed.  Is the issue how quickly the notes speak or the physical one of bellows control?

Steve
Title: Re: Bandonika.
Post by: 911377brian on January 15, 2015, 12:38:51 PM
I think it's more in the way of bellows control Steve, plus one of the two bellows frames in the middle of the box is leaking badly, along with a few of the bellows gussets. Not a problem as it is all fixable and I always saw it a a bit of a fetling project anyway. I think I'm more curious as to how she should sound when in good order....
Title: Re: Bandonika.
Post by: Chris Ryall on January 15, 2015, 02:49:43 PM
Just to say that this interesting instument has stimulated me to buy a bandonèon

I must be MAD ::)
Title: Re: Bandonika.
Post by: Sebastian on January 15, 2015, 03:20:43 PM
Just to say that this interesting instument has stimulated me to buy a bandonèon
Yes, me too: Every time I see a downspout I am stimulated to buy an oboe.
Title: Re: Bandonika.
Post by: pikey on January 15, 2015, 06:38:39 PM
Chris, bandoneons and bandonika are separate beasts. Sadly I have both......

But not an oboe. Pink or any other colour.
Title: Re: Bandonika.
Post by: 911377brian on January 15, 2015, 07:54:09 PM
Have you ever put a bandonika tune on You tube Pikey? If not, please do.....
Title: Re: Bandonika.
Post by: Chris Ryall on January 15, 2015, 08:07:51 PM
Confess I have had them confused recently, but i've bought the one I'm interested in, partly for its history. i won't be able to pick it up for a few weeks … then … how to tame it? (:)
Title: Re: Bandonika.
Post by: oggiesnr on January 15, 2015, 10:44:24 PM
Just to say that this interesting instument has stimulated me to buy a bandonèon

I must be MAD ::)

No, you're BAD  ;D

Steve
Title: Re: Bandonika.
Post by: pikey on January 15, 2015, 11:41:02 PM
Bandonika currently on holiday  with Dr  Rowbotham  ;)
Title: Re: Bandonika.
Post by: 911377brian on January 16, 2015, 05:07:59 PM
That's what she told you Pikey, I bet she's gone for treatment. Anyway, it's good for Mike to get some practice in before I send Brunhilda off to him... ;)
Title: Re: Bandonika.
Post by: Rob2Hook on January 31, 2015, 01:08:48 PM
A Rowbotham refurb should do wonders for the playability of your bandonika.  Once airtight and with the reeds reset and valves in good order it will be much easier to get some oomph out of it!

I would imagine that using cross row techniques will suit it very well.

Rob.
Title: Re: Bandonika.
Post by: 911377brian on January 31, 2015, 05:59:33 PM
Cross rowing would be nice Rob, but I can't actually reach the top row, and only a few of the bass buttons come to hand, or rather finger..at the moment I'm tarting the old girl up a bit cosmetically and trying to work out a playing technique in between times...I always believed I had big hands but have just realised that they are very wide but not that long...I was interested to find that the buttons are actually wooden dowels glued to the arms and with the visible part painted white, easy to replicate I should think... Unless someone just happens to have a drawer full lurked up somewhere......
Title: Re: Bandonika.
Post by: 911377brian on February 12, 2015, 08:06:11 PM
Anyone got any experience of painting the buttons? I can think of quite a few finishes that would maybe do the trick but would like to hear from anyone that had done the job....bit unlikely I suppose.... ???
Title: Re: Bandonika.
Post by: oggiesnr on February 16, 2015, 03:39:50 PM
Anyone got any experience of painting the buttons? I can think of quite a few finishes that would maybe do the trick but would like to hear from anyone that had done the job....bit unlikely I suppose.... ???

Any chance of a picture of the "buttons"?  Finish will depend on just what wood they are, the trick is to seal the end grain first.

Steve
Title: Re: Bandonika.
Post by: 911377brian on February 17, 2015, 10:22:52 AM
Steve, I'll try and grab a grandchild this weekend to take a picky; meanwhile, the buttons/dowels are well sealed with paint with the exception of one that's a replacement and is'nt painted. They seem to be softwood, attached to the pallet arms with little strips of leather, rather like reed valves....
Title: Re: Bandonika.
Post by: malcolmbebb on February 17, 2015, 10:56:00 AM
The ones I've looked at are typically a wooden shaft/dowel with a plastic end cap. Could there be a cap lurking under the paint?
Title: Re: Bandonika.
Post by: 911377brian on February 17, 2015, 12:08:19 PM
I've had another shufti Malcolm and there does seem to be a very thin cap, slightly domed on each of the dowels. Will be in hospital for a few days but when I escape I'll take a closer look...
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