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Discussions => Other Free Reed Instruments => Topic started by: boscaceol on June 02, 2018, 05:19:59 PM

Title: 80 bass Paolo Soprani accordion left in the sun
Post by: boscaceol on June 02, 2018, 05:19:59 PM
Hi guys,
I know that this is a bit taboo to mention a piano accordion on this forum however a friend brought me this for 'help' - my
question is regarding the left hand that took the biggest hit, have you any idea where I could get a layout to determin where those loose reeds belong?
regards John
Title: Re: 80 bass Paolo Soprani accordion left in the sun
Post by: diatonix on June 02, 2018, 05:21:59 PM
I'd leave this job to an expert.
Title: Re: 80 bass Paolo Soprani accordion left in the sun
Post by: Lester on June 02, 2018, 05:27:39 PM
When I get jobs like this it is usually possible to jigsaw it back together by aligning the wax left on the reed plates and that left on the reed blocks.

Other wise you need to work out which pallets are being lifted by which buttons the work out which pitch reeds need to go in the block positions to make the correct bass or chord. Good mental exercise.
Title: Re: 80 bass Paolo Soprani accordion left in the sun
Post by: Pearse Rossa on June 02, 2018, 06:36:32 PM
... have you any idea where I could get a layout to determin where those loose reeds belong?

You might have more luck asking the question here. (https://www.accordionists.co.uk/)
Title: Re: 80 bass Paolo Soprani accordion left in the sun
Post by: invadm on June 02, 2018, 08:04:13 PM
sent it to an expert and get the job done properly, more than likely you will have tuning issues, after fitting them all back might need to tune some of them if not all.
Title: Re: 80 bass Paolo Soprani accordion left in the sun
Post by: RogerT on June 02, 2018, 11:35:49 PM
If you know the layout of a stradella bass then work up the fundamental row and observe which pallet opens as you press each button in turn, then annotate one of the reed blocks with the corresponding note. On stradella systems you don’t have combinations of reeds forming a chord like you do on a diatonic box. The reeds all occupy the same position...e.g. on yours there are 4 voices and, say, all the C reeds sit crossways in the two blocks. The order is either going to be the circle of 5ths, which matches the order of the stradella system, or in chromatic order, starting with (probably) F at one end and F# at the other. As this is a PA the reeds are unisoric so you don’t have the added complication of working out which way round to put the reeds back.
Title: Re: 80 bass Paolo Soprani accordion left in the sun
Post by: tirpous on June 02, 2018, 11:53:34 PM
Quote
As this is a PA the reeds are unisoric so you don’t have the added complication of working out which way round to put the reeds back.

Silly question maybe: on reedplates for diatonic boxes, there is a corner slash to identify the outside face.  Is it the same for PA reeds ??

Title: Re: 80 bass Paolo Soprani accordion left in the sun
Post by: Winston Smith on June 03, 2018, 12:36:53 AM
As Roger has said, it shouldn't make any difference which way around they go.
Nevertheless, all the PA's which I've scrapped, to harvest the reeds, have had some marking on the outer face when they've been taken to bits. The T on the Hohners, and an M on a couple of others spring to mind. So, what is the point, unless the makers want their marks to be noticed?
Title: Re: 80 bass Paolo Soprani accordion left in the sun
Post by: triskel on June 03, 2018, 05:40:21 AM
As Roger has said, it shouldn't make any difference which way around they go.
... So, what is the point, unless the makers want their marks to be noticed?

But it can make a difference - to the fine tuning.

Whilst we'd all be complaining about them hiding the make and standard of the reeds if they were facing into the reed blocks...
Title: Re: 80 bass Paolo Soprani accordion left in the sun
Post by: Steve_freereeder on June 03, 2018, 08:06:15 AM
As Roger has said, it shouldn't make any difference which way around they go.
... So, what is the point, unless the makers want their marks to be noticed?
But it can make a difference - to the fine tuning.

Triskel got there before me...  ;)

Yes - it makes a difference which way round the reed plates are mounted. The obvious (or perhaps not so obvious?) example of this is when 'flipping' the accidentals reed plates on a melodeon in order to change the push note to a pull and vice versa. The accidentals may well be in tune prior to flipping, but you can nearly always guarantee that after flipping, some fine tuning will be required because of the changed acoustic environment surrounding the reed tongues.

I suppose you could argue that on a unisonoric accordion there is no need to flip any of the reed plates, but there is always a possibility that a reed plate may need to be removed for some reason - perhaps to change the valves - so there is a need to identify which way round they go. Mind you, after replacing a valve there is usually a need for fine tuning anyway...  ::)
Title: Re: 80 bass Paolo Soprani accordion left in the sun
Post by: RogerT on June 03, 2018, 08:33:08 AM
..yes a fair point. I always take care to put them back the same way they came off. The marking doesn’t always show which way they were actually put on. I look for traces of wax around the rivet to see which was the outer reed. But I’m normally tuning them anyway after a rebuild.