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Discussions => Instrument Design, Construction and Repair => Topic started by: Julian S on June 20, 2018, 04:40:43 PM

Title: Reducing wear on bellows tape
Post by: Julian S on June 20, 2018, 04:40:43 PM
Whether it's a fault of my playing style, or how I position the box, I seem to always wear away the tape on the first three or four edges at the bottom of the bellows, on the rear close to treble end. I probably need a repair pretty soon, as the metal corners are increasingly exposed. Any hints on repairs and ways of preventing this problem would be much appreciated ! Both my Saltarelle and Dino Super 3 are affected, hasn't been a problem on the Dony - as yet...

Thanks in anticipation...

J
Title: Re: Reducing wear on bellows tape
Post by: Theo on June 20, 2018, 04:57:51 PM
I don't have much to suggest for avoiding wear, apart from removing buckles or other hard things in your clothing.

Repairs are straightforward.  Get the proper material, and replace whole strips.  Don't use gaffa tape, insulating tape or anything similar, even as a temporary repair.  It ends up as a stick mess that will earn you the disrespect of any repairer who subsequently works on the instrument.
Title: Re: Reducing wear on bellows tape
Post by: Anahata on June 20, 2018, 04:58:51 PM
Charlie Marshall has Bellow Protectors (http://www.cgmmusical.co.uk/CGM_Musical_Services/Bellow_Protectors.html) in a range of sizes, which might help on the prevention part of your question.
Title: Re: Reducing wear on bellows tape
Post by: Tone Dumb Greg on June 20, 2018, 05:04:32 PM
I have had the same problem on a couple of instruments. The Chinese Hohner is repaired with bellows tape patched over the wear. Not the prettiest of repairs but effective, and the patches show no sign of wear after a few years. I believe the Chinese Hohners is a bit notorious for thin/weak bellows tape. There is a bit of wear on the Saltarelle, but nothing like as bad and it doesn't seem to be getting any worse.
I imagine the solution has to be retaping the inside edges with matching tape.

How do you get the old tape off? Or could you leave it on (this seems rather naff)?

I think the problem may be exacerbated by playing sitting down.
Title: Re: Reducing wear on bellows tape
Post by: John MacKenzie (Cugiok) on June 20, 2018, 05:27:28 PM
Well if as I suspect you are like me a single strap player, then you will get this problem. Two thoughts occur, one angle the top top of the box away from you to reduce the area in contact with clothing, and two, lengthen the shoulder strap till the bottom of the treble end is resting on your left thigh, assuming you are right handed, and this leaves all of the bellows airborne ;)

Sir John
Title: Re: Reducing wear on bellows tape
Post by: Tamba on June 20, 2018, 05:40:48 PM
Play naked! :||: :|bl
Title: Re: Reducing wear on bellows tape
Post by: Julian S on June 20, 2018, 05:43:18 PM
Sounds like I'd best learn to repair the tape properly for starters, buy a bellows protector - and lengthen the strap as an immediate measure ! Otherwise the problem will be much worse by Monday - given there'll be a bit of playing this weekend at Halsway... :||: :|glug ;D

J

Ps playing naked could cause other problems I reckon !
Title: Re: Reducing wear on bellows tape
Post by: Tamba on June 20, 2018, 05:54:03 PM
 :o
Title: Re: Reducing wear on bellows tape
Post by: Tone Dumb Greg on June 21, 2018, 12:56:59 AM
Play naked! :||: :|bl

That could lead to the need to repair skin tissue.

These are Charlie Marshall's bellows protectors. How are they supposed to be implemented?

http://www.cgmmusical.co.uk/CGM_Musical_Services/Bellow_Protectors.html

Title: Re: Reducing wear on bellows tape
Post by: Anahata on June 21, 2018, 07:22:39 AM
Press studs. As it says on CGM's page: 'stud fixing'.
Title: Re: Reducing wear on bellows tape
Post by: richard.fleming on June 21, 2018, 07:39:46 AM
Play Irish style - the right hand part of the body of the box wedged against the outside of the left thigh and the bellows in mid air. No wear at all and a very stable position once you've got the hang of it.
Title: Re: Reducing wear on bellows tape
Post by: Graham Spencer on June 21, 2018, 08:27:26 AM
Play Irish style - the right hand part of the body of the box wedged against the outside of the left thigh and the bellows in mid air. No wear at all and a very stable position once you've got the hang of it.

Bit awkward if you're standing up, though......
Title: Re: Reducing wear on bellows tape
Post by: Tone Dumb Greg on June 21, 2018, 09:31:43 AM
Press studs. As it says on CGM's page: 'stud fixing'.

Nope. Still don't get it. Anyone use one?
Title: Re: Reducing wear on bellows tape
Post by: Theo on June 21, 2018, 09:38:09 AM
Press studs. As it says on CGM's page: 'stud fixing'.

Nope. Still don't get it. Anyone use one?

The pad comes with press studs.  You use screws to fasten the base of the stud to the back of the treble side of your instrument, then you fix the pad to the press studs.  The press studs mean your tuner can remove the pad easily while working on the instrument, and when it gets worn it's easy to replace.
Title: Re: Reducing wear on bellows tape
Post by: Tone Dumb Greg on June 21, 2018, 10:51:45 AM
Press studs. As it says on CGM's page: 'stud fixing'.

Nope. Still don't get it. Anyone use one?

The pad comes with press studs.  You use screws to fasten the base of the stud to the back of the treble side of your instrument, then you fix the pad to the press studs.  The press studs mean your tuner can remove the pad easily while working on the instrument, and when it gets worn it's easy to replace.

Thanks Theo. I thought it would be something like that but, don't the bellows jut rub on the pad instead of you?
Title: Re: Reducing wear on bellows tape
Post by: Theo on June 21, 2018, 10:58:39 AM
Yes, but the pad is soft and has a smooth nylon covering designed to wear less that the average clothing.
Title: Re: Reducing wear on bellows tape
Post by: Steve Coombes on June 21, 2018, 11:01:07 AM

Another thought for the mix. As a two strap player I found that I needed to shorten my straps as the main cause of wear was coming from my belt buckle and the belt was part of the Morris kit so that had to stay. The effect was less rock and roll but did give me a more stable setup.


Does the bellows protector make the melodeon fell different/strange to play?
Title: Re: Reducing wear on bellows tape
Post by: Julian S on June 21, 2018, 11:15:58 AM
I think I will try a bellows protector, and maybe experiment with self adhesive velcro to attach it. Will report in due course.
Self adhesive bellows tape - now why not ? Could also do with handy patches for short term repairs !

J
Title: Re: Reducing wear on bellows tape
Post by: Tone Dumb Greg on June 21, 2018, 11:26:33 AM
I think I will try a bellows protector, and maybe experiment with self adhesive velcro to attach it. Will report in due course.
Self adhesive bellows tape - now why not ? Could also do with handy patches for short term repairs !

J

The Lester way has been recommended.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UwQ1ZCbmNq8

Still worried about wrecking the bellows removing old tape, though. Can't remember seeing anything about it anywhere.

Title: Re: Reducing wear on bellows tape
Post by: Graham Spencer on June 21, 2018, 11:44:04 AM
Bellows tape removal/renewal has been covered a number of times; someone will be able to link to an appropriate discussion, I'm sure.  Simply put, you moisten the tape, give the glue a minute or so to soften and then work it away from the bellows VERY CAREFULLY AND SLOWLY with a blade of your choice; I use a scalpel, but others may have different ideas. You'll need to keep the tape moist as you work along the length - I use a watercolour brush and warm water, but again others will have other methods. It takes a lot of patience - it's not the world's most exciting job, but essential if you're going to fit new tape.

Graham
Title: Re: Reducing wear on bellows tape
Post by: Graham Spencer on June 21, 2018, 11:51:06 AM
http://forum.melodeon.net/index.php/topic,9188.msg114224.html#msg114224 (http://forum.melodeon.net/index.php/topic,9188.msg114224.html#msg114224)
Title: Re: Reducing wear on bellows tape
Post by: Anahata on June 21, 2018, 01:22:58 PM
don't the bellows jut rub on the pad instead of you?

To amplify what Theo said, It's generally not the clothes, but hard objects like strap buckles, a belt buckle and possibly buttons or zippers on your clothing that do the damage.
Title: Re: Reducing wear on bellows tape
Post by: Tone Dumb Greg on June 21, 2018, 03:11:19 PM
http://forum.melodeon.net/index.php/topic,9188.msg114224.html#msg114224 (http://forum.melodeon.net/index.php/topic,9188.msg114224.html#msg114224)

Thanks. That's the information. Do I fancy tackling it now? Erm...not encouraged. Sounds like a pig of a job.
Title: Re: Reducing wear on bellows tape
Post by: Tone Dumb Greg on June 21, 2018, 03:14:53 PM
If someone felt like making an on-line book of "how to fix it posts", or even just index posts by problems, it would be a hell of a resource.
Title: Re: Reducing wear on bellows tape
Post by: Theo on June 21, 2018, 03:21:53 PM
If someone felt like making an on-line book of "how to fix it posts", or even just index posts by problems, it would be a hell of a resource.

It just needs a volunteer.  Are you offering?

Or you can look here (http://www.accordionrevival.com/).  It is all based on piano accordions, but much of the techniques are the same or similar.
Title: Re: Reducing wear on bellows tape
Post by: Graham Spencer on June 21, 2018, 03:41:17 PM
http://forum.melodeon.net/index.php/topic,9188.msg114224.html#msg114224 (http://forum.melodeon.net/index.php/topic,9188.msg114224.html#msg114224)

Thanks. That's the information. Do I fancy tackling it now? Erm...not encouraged. Sounds like a pig of a job.

It is. But  think of the sense of satisfaction..... ;)
Title: Re: Reducing wear on bellows tape
Post by: boxer on June 21, 2018, 07:25:04 PM
richard.fleming's recommendation is sound.  If you have to play standing up, and use two straps to pin the box tight to your chest, try moving the l/h side in an arc as you work the bellows, moving away from you body as the bellows extend, rather than straight left-right.  That way there's less contact between the back of the bellows and your clothing, and it helps stabilise the right hand side as well.
Title: Re: Reducing wear on bellows tape
Post by: Tone Dumb Greg on June 21, 2018, 09:36:34 PM
If someone felt like making an on-line book of "how to fix it posts", or even just index posts by problems, it would be a hell of a resource.

It just needs a volunteer.  Are you offering?

Or you can look here (http://www.accordionrevival.com/).  It is all based on piano accordions, but much of the techniques are the same or similar.

Nice site, but not quite what I had in mind. It's the discussions here that are interesting and a search doesn't produce half of what's there. There are only 2400 topics posted... now, if I had the computer skills...
Title: Re: Reducing wear on bellows tape
Post by: playandteach on June 22, 2018, 12:19:44 AM
I have used bellows pads with the screw on snap fasteners - and I believe that the quick tidy screw on fittings don't do anything sinister compared to the shirt buttons / belt buckles etc.
My mother in law made some beautiful Chinese silk ones for my Piano accordion. They were easy to fit using hammer on fabric female ends.
Since I lost some weight the wear has become worse - either because my corpulence had been a ameliorating factor, or because I haven't quite sorted out the new strap length.
Title: Re: Reducing wear on bellows tape
Post by: Fred on June 22, 2018, 01:07:28 AM
If someone felt like making an on-line book of "how to fix it posts", or even just index posts by problems, it would be a hell of a resource.

It just needs a volunteer.  Are you offering?

Or you can look here (http://www.accordionrevival.com/).  It is all based on piano accordions, but much of the techniques are the same or similar.

Nice site, but not quite what I had in mind. It's the discussions here that are interesting and a search doesn't produce half of what's there. There are only 2400 topics posted... now, if I had the computer skills...

Well, I might be tempted to search through the topics by hand and put together such a list. I often enough also thought about compiling such a list of topics for everyone to look up once a question about repairing arises.

Problem is: I have a master's thesis to write in the next months and if I (finally) do any work at all, then it shouldn't be for a forum thread compilation but instead for my graduation. ;-)

Long story short: I support the idea of such a compilation of repair threads!
Title: Re: Reducing wear on bellows tape
Post by: george garside on June 22, 2018, 10:41:46 AM
richard.fleming's recommendation is sound.  If you have to play standing up, and use two straps to pin the box tight to your chest, try moving the l/h side in an arc as you work the bellows, moving away from you body as the bellows extend, rather than straight left-right.  That way there's less contact between the back of the bellows and your clothing, and it helps stabilise the right hand side as well.

I also helps two have the right hand strap longer than the left so the treble end is against your chest  and most of the bellows are clear or at least where your body starts to reduce in diameter.

This together with the bellwos following a 'fan' shaped arc should totally prevent bellows wear. My 2 row serenelli which has  been heavily played over 20 plus years has absolutely no sign of bellows wear .

george

Title: Re: Reducing wear on bellows tape
Post by: Ebor_fiddler on June 26, 2018, 11:54:46 PM
I am still using the (cheap!) soft covers that you can buy from Halfords which are designed to prevent the car safety belt cutting into your shoulders. They do an excellent job of preventing the big brass buckles on my trouser belts from damaging the bellows or the bodywork of my instruments.
Title: Re: Reducing wear on bellows tape
Post by: baz parkes on June 27, 2018, 10:56:03 AM

Since I lost some weight the wear has become worse - either because my corpulence had been a ameliorating factor

Looking at the wear on my bellows tape I would suggest this may not be the case... :|glug
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