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Author Topic: Where to Study for a Year  (Read 10105 times)

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Chris Ryall

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Re: Where to Study for a Year
« Reply #20 on: December 08, 2012, 07:14:04 AM »

Both France and Belgium prefer GC and there is an important overlap in music and musicians and in balls many of the dances (andro, hanterdro etc ) are French too. Of course if you are interested in the more specific fest noz kind of bretonne dancing Flanders wouldn't be the right place to come to.

Indeed. 200+ young people up to dance the gavotte (!) at last year's Levendegem Boombal festival was astonishing. I've not personally seen that outside Brittany itself, Paris's mission bretonne, or the big metropolitan French festivals. There's a real phenomenon going on there.

And the current scene is very 'French'! I've done a few Dutch ethnic dances in my youth: kort met stroop, hakke-toone etc, but they are few, and I've not come across anything specifically Flemish or even Waloone (though I've probably missed out in life?)

Quote
PS maybe the Flemish speak better English ;) that would be an argument for Ghent ;)

Think they probably do - especially Gent way as it's so full of students.  Though trying to find Evergem 'out in the sticks '10 years ago, neither French or English was of any use ::)
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docEdock

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Re: Where to Study for a Year
« Reply #21 on: December 08, 2012, 09:29:39 AM »

I'm glad I'm not the only one thinking that, isn't that a bit like going to Scotland to learn about ITM.... ???

IIRC, both Antwerp and Ghent are Dutch-speaking cities and I don't think any Belgians would take too kindly to their distinctly different music and dance being called "French stuff".

Good point. I would be appalled if someone called western swing or 12 bar blues New York stuff. I'm working my way through Yann Dour's three volume tutorial. It includes world music (Finland, Breton, Cajun, Italian, Irish, Argentina, . . .) for G/C accordeon diatonique accompanied by a narrative in French. Thus, in my mind, the French stuff. I should really name what I want to learn diatonic stuff with a continental drift and flavored with a soupçon of French something or other. Perepau Jimenez fits in somehow along with Cyrille Brotto and Naragonia.

Think they probably do - especially Gent way as it's so full of students. 

I'm adding yet another characteristic to my list, in hindsight: a university town. Having hung around those places a bit, I am fond of their ability to provide lodging, food and entertainment to a transient population of limited means and language skills. Perhaps an itinerant beginner musician should be able to blend in as suggested by http://www.ugent.be/en/living.

I notice a visa requirement with the proviso: "Not be considered a threat to public order, national (domestic) security, public health or the international relations of Belgium or the other Schengen countries." In my application I will certainly avoid mentioning playing melodeon at my skill level.

Thanks for the tips on leases and how to find affordable lodging. I'm off to learn more about real estate and sub-lets. This will be an adventure.
« Last Edit: December 08, 2012, 10:36:05 AM by docEdock »
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Chris Ryall

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Re: Where to Study for a Year
« Reply #22 on: December 08, 2012, 09:57:14 AM »

The best Bed&Breakfast in Ghent (if you need a base to look) is BBKings http://www.bedandbreakfastking.be/  and is (very) music friendly.  But if you decide to go to Ghent rather than Antwerp I can possibly network you lodgings (no promises)

Antwerp has a university of course www.ua.ac.be/ - but is a busy port/city.  Ghent feels .. like Cambridge
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docEdock

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Re: Where to Study for a Year
« Reply #23 on: December 08, 2012, 10:29:30 AM »

Try www.vlan.be - it will give you an idea of what's there and there's an English interface. The expatica or similar sites will have stuff that is usually wildly more expensive.

Thanks for the tip about how the price drops once one wanders into the local economy rather than the tourist zone. I'm realizing that I want a Furnished Apartment in the 9000+ zip code, which may be named a BizFlat. No details yet about how the lease might work, but prices are not too astonishing. Wait, those are euros plus various fees? Oh dear.
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docEdock

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Re: Where to Study for a Year
« Reply #24 on: December 08, 2012, 10:35:03 AM »

Antwerp has a university of course www.ua.ac.be/ - but is a busy port/city.  Ghent feels .. like Cambridge

If Ghent feels like Cambridge feels like Dartmouth College in Hanover, New Hampshire, then Ghent it is. I'm inordinately fond of villages attached to universities; so fond it took me six years to complete my studies. I would have stayed forever but they kicked me out.
« Last Edit: December 08, 2012, 10:38:27 AM by docEdock »
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Jono

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Re: Where to Study for a Year
« Reply #25 on: December 08, 2012, 11:22:39 AM »

Forgive my ignorance, but are there lots of workshops/ music camps in Europe that specialise in teaching melodeon playing?
« Last Edit: December 08, 2012, 12:20:25 PM by Jono »
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diatosoldo

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Re: Where to Study for a Year
« Reply #26 on: December 08, 2012, 01:11:14 PM »

Both France and Belgium prefer GC and there is an important overlap in music and musicians and in balls many of the dances (andro, hanterdro etc ) are French too. Of course if you are interested in the more specific fest noz kind of bretonne dancing Flanders wouldn't be the right place to come to.


You should investigate (outside of Brittany) :
Clermont Ferrand (in Auvergne) : university, school for traditionnal music, they dance bourrées, many "bal folks", regional instruments as cabrettes, vielles ... and really "France profonde" atmosphere  ;)
Poitiers (in région Pays de la Loire) : university, school for traditional music, they dance "maraichines, avant deux, pas d'été, marchoises ...
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Re: Where to Study for a Year
« Reply #27 on: December 08, 2012, 01:22:45 PM »

Good point. I would be appalled if someone called western swing or 12 bar blues New York stuff. I'm working my way through Yann Dour's three volume tutorial. It includes world music (Finland, Breton, Cajun, Italian, Irish, Argentina, . . .) for G/C accordeon diatonique accompanied by a narrative in French. Thus, in my mind, the French stuff. I should really name what I want to learn diatonic stuff with a continental drift and flavored with a soupçon of French something or other. Perepau Jimenez fits in somehow along with Cyrille Brotto and Naragonia.

Brittany has its own culture and language, beware for referring to it as "French stuff". I imagine the reaction would be a bit like calling Scottish music "English stuff" which could start a fight in certain parts of Scotland!   
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Re: Where to Study for a Year
« Reply #28 on: December 08, 2012, 01:38:36 PM »



Brittany has its own culture and language, beware for referring to it as "French stuff". I imagine the reaction would be a bit like calling Scottish music "English stuff" which could start a fight in certain parts of Scotland!
[/quote]

The Bretons are in fact Celts,  bit like the Scots and the Welsh who are just the Irish who couldn't swim.
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Re: Where to Study for a Year
« Reply #29 on: December 08, 2012, 02:10:13 PM »

Forgive my ignorance, but are there lots of workshops/ music camps in Europe that specialise in teaching melodeon playing?
At the Damada festival there is two days free tuition included but you need to put your name down fast. I don't know how your Dutch is 'cos there are a few fun ones around here (there are tune learning sessions at the boombal festival - but the week before there is a four day folk music workshop (stage) but not specifically melodeon and also dance lessons. There is also the "stages" at the kalmthout folk festival and there is a lovely festival called Gooikoorts were there are workshops.

And Trek er es uut in the Netherlands sometimes has English speaking workshops (most of them are CF but a few are C or GC)

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Re: Where to Study for a Year
« Reply #30 on: December 08, 2012, 02:15:45 PM »

The best Bed&Breakfast in Ghent (if you need a base to look) is BBKings http://www.bedandbreakfastking.be/  and is (very) music friendly.  But if you decide to go to Ghent rather than Antwerp I can possibly network you lodgings (no promises)

Antwerp has a university of course www.ua.ac.be/ - but is a busy port/city.  Ghent feels .. like Cambridge

Ow Chris, you don't happen to know a similar very music friendly place somewhere in a green part of Belgium, next week I'd like to go walking with a friend and we can't bear to leave our instruments at home but don't want to be lynched in the process (sorry for being blatantly off topic here).
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docEdock

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Re: Where to Study for a Year
« Reply #31 on: December 08, 2012, 08:00:00 PM »

You should investigate (outside of Brittany) :
Clermont Ferrand (in Auvergne) : university, school for traditionnal music, they dance bourrées, many "bal folks", regional instruments as cabrettes, vielles ... and really "France profonde" atmosphere  ;)
Poitiers (in région Pays de la Loire) : university, school for traditional music, they dance "maraichines, avant deux, pas d'été, marchoises ...

Thanks for the tip. I am not familiar with these towns and had you not mentioned them, I wouldn't have known. I look forward to Googling so that I can understand what they offer.

Fortunately it won't be all or none in terms of where to visit. We plan to establish a home base and also travel to interesting places. (I hear, from my spouse, that the Cotswold's and the Victoria and Albert Museum are on her short list.)
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Chris Ryall

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Re: Where to Study for a Year
« Reply #32 on: December 09, 2012, 12:19:16 AM »

Ow Chris, you don't happen to know a similar very music friendly place somewhere in a green part of Belgium, next week I'd like to go walking with a friend and we can't bear to leave our instruments at home but don't want to be lynched in the process (sorry for being blatantly off topic here).

Nope .. got a great place in Amsterdam (Singel 83) if that's any help. Their motto is "those poor people in the Hilton"   B&B King is actually  - better  :P

You should investigate (outside of Brittany) : Clermont Ferrand (in Auvergne) : university, school for traditionnal music, they dance bourrées, many "bal folks", regional instruments as cabrettes, vielles ... and really "France profonde" atmosphere  ;)  Poitiers (in région Pays de la Loire) : university, school for traditional music, they dance "maraichines, avant deux, pas d'été, marchoises ...

Thanks. Poitiers sounds fantastic - never got there - looks like I've missed out. I have been to Clermont Ferrand and it's fantastic. Their music is powerful and punchy. Their top Gurdy players are Chabenat and Bouffard (often in duo). Bagpiping is mega and I've watched the bourrée there explode from a 'normal dance' to something that needs about 6m2 per couple over the last 20 years or so. Another cultural hot spot (though perhaps not for melodeon). Google 'festival les Volcaniques', run by the Brayauds group. Was early July this year - 2013 = no info yet.
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Re: Where to Study for a Year
« Reply #33 on: December 10, 2012, 04:37:39 PM »

Going on a diatonic cruise for a year turns out to be more complex than simply selecting a town. After speaking with the Belgium Consulate, I now understand that staying for more than 90 days to study music with a private tutor is not permitted.

Were I to enroll in a university I could stay for years. Otherwise as a tourist I would be limited to 90 days every six months. I suspect that University of Ghent doesn't offer a degree in button box. I'm not much interested in going down an academic path anyway. I'd really hate to have to come and go rather than settle in. So I'm reading up on the Shengen Area countries to see if this restriction applies to, say, France.

Perhaps an USA expat in Belgium could shed some light on how they manage it. Anyone know of one?
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Re: Where to Study for a Year
« Reply #34 on: December 10, 2012, 04:57:12 PM »

Shengen affects the whole area. There are NO internal frontiers, no customs houses any more. It's a common border.  But if you time the trip to London at say 80 days you can reapply from there. As a US citizen (presumably) there'd be few problems unless you'd been naughty. The hard one might be getting back into USofA  ;)

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Re: Where to Study for a Year
« Reply #35 on: December 10, 2012, 05:04:00 PM »



The Bretons are in fact Celts,  bit like the Scots and the Welsh who are just the Irish who couldn't swim.

Sod off, you English twat!
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Re: Where to Study for a Year
« Reply #36 on: December 10, 2012, 05:50:55 PM »



The Bretons are in fact Celts,  bit like the Scots and the Welsh who are just the Irish who couldn't swim.

Sod off, you English twat!
Yes, if I were in Wales, I would certainly stay put!  One of the most beautiful patches on the planet.
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Andy Simpson

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Re: Where to Study for a Year
« Reply #37 on: December 10, 2012, 06:16:16 PM »

Going on a diatonic cruise for a year turns out to be more complex than simply selecting a town. After speaking with the Belgium Consulate, I now understand that staying for more than 90 days to study music with a private tutor is not permitted.

Were I to enroll in a university I could stay for years. Otherwise as a tourist I would be limited to 90 days every six months. I suspect that University of Ghent doesn't offer a degree in button box. I'm not much interested in going down an academic path anyway. I'd really hate to have to come and go rather than settle in. So I'm reading up on the Shengen Area countries to see if this restriction applies to, say, France.

Perhaps an USA expat in Belgium could shed some light on how they manage it. Anyone know of one?

Schengen is just a common area without border restrictions for short short term and transient travel between countries that have signed up to the Schengen Agreement. Immigration policies across EU member states for non-EU citizens are mostly down to the country they're trying to get into.

Citizens of EU countries have the right to work or reside in other member states and only have to apply for a relevant permit if they're going to be staying longer than 90 days. For a non-EU citizen it's a whole different kettle of fish and they're not automatically entitled to any of that. To reside in Belgium, France or anywhere else outside the time tourists are allowed would require you to apply for a student visa or a work permit and unless you've got a university place or a job waiting for you then you won't be granted one. I'm not entirely sure of the details and it will vary from country to country but I think you might be able to apply for permanent residence or something like it if you can prove that you're capable of supporting yourself financially. There might be certain conditions attached to that, (eg, you might have to own property in that country), so you'd have to investigate further to see what would be possible where you want to go.
« Last Edit: December 10, 2012, 06:48:01 PM by Andy Simpson »
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Re: Where to Study for a Year
« Reply #38 on: December 10, 2012, 06:16:22 PM »



The Bretons are in fact Celts,  bit like the Scots and the Welsh who are just the Irish who couldn't swim.

Sod off, you English twat!

Taken on the cheek like a good'un.  If we can't take the mickey out of each other, and let's face it we do and that is the fun of being British. I think we all have a secret admiration for our various  customs.
What a wonderful mix we are. We should be so proud of that. Irish jokes, Scottish Jokes, Welsh? Not sure about that. I think they all have webbed feet, and me being of Dutch origin.. Huh! I should talk!
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Andy Simpson

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Re: Where to Study for a Year
« Reply #39 on: December 10, 2012, 07:02:04 PM »

I am reliably informed, (coincidentally dealing with something sort of related myself), that what you need to look at is a "long stay visa".
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