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Author Topic: treble pallets  (Read 5837 times)

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Nick Collis Bird

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Re: treble pallets
« Reply #20 on: November 29, 2012, 12:52:11 PM »

People are repairing and overhauling 120+ year old concertinas, so ease of reversal and removal should always be a consideration.

Absolutely right Malcolm , I dread to think what book restorers in a hundred years time will think of us after all the non- reversible PVA we have thrown around. Nearly all my restoration career I have only had to deal with animal glue, which is a doddle to remove.
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Adam-T

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Re: treble pallets
« Reply #21 on: November 29, 2012, 01:47:50 PM »

good point about valuable colectable antiques Nick but most of us are re-facing pallets on scruffy old and very common Hohners (the OP mentioned an Erica) . working musical instruments,  not stuff destined for museums or uber-valuable stuff like Jeffries concertinas.

It`s easy to get too anal about all this, fine with collectable old Paolos, current boutique Italian stuff, even hohners if they`re oddballs, short run or downright expensive but the rest are there to be used, often used HARD and lets face it, the pallets need sanding down when changing the facings anyway to level and remove any warp etc so any PVA left on there is going to be sanded along with the process..
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malcolmbebb

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Re: treble pallets
« Reply #22 on: November 29, 2012, 02:15:28 PM »

good point about valuable colectable antiques Nick but most of us are re-facing pallets on scruffy old and very common Hohners (the OP mentioned an Erica) . working musical instruments,  not stuff destined for museums or uber-valuable stuff like Jeffries concertinas.

Don't agree.
I have a c1895 Lachenal concertina. It has seen a lot of use, and still plays fine. It's the (concertina) Pokerwork of its day. Loads of them are still going strong. I have a couple more waiting overhaul.

Most Liliputs are 70+  years old, Erikas around the same, lots of 1930s and 1940s "everyday" boxes going strong, getting used and giving a lot of pleasure.
Without getting too deep into the specifics of PVA, I can see no good reason to make it hard(er) for someone to restore a box in fifty years time, for the sake of a bit of laziness or trivial cost cutting, even if today I think it commonplace. The mere fact that somebody is caring for it today improves its chances of being around in fifty years anyway.
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Andy Simpson

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Re: treble pallets
« Reply #23 on: November 29, 2012, 02:19:14 PM »

You're gluing it to felt, even if you'd araldited them on all you'd have to do is peel the facings away and sand the glue off.

Bit of a non-issue here methinks...
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Adam-T

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Re: treble pallets
« Reply #24 on: November 29, 2012, 02:25:46 PM »

My Point exactly Andy - you have to sand them anyway !

Most Liliputs are 70+  years old, Erikas around the same, lots of 1930s and 1940s "everyday" boxes going strong, getting used and giving a lot of pleasure.

Correct and often still running on the original pallet facings (espeically Liliputs) - which I may add are no easier to deal with than when stuck with PVA as you still have to sand the pallets down to get them even afterwards. it`s no easier to use PVA than anything else (so hardly lazy) and cost cutting is only evident in the facings used, I recommended the best . PVA does however strong bond of the facings on the pallets and doesn`t ruin the wood anyway ......

it`s not as if we`re talking about filling air leak gaps in soundboards with reedwax or glueing reedblocks in when they`re usually removable, gluing bass machines in sticking reeds in with araldite or using superglue on reedvalves or anything. those kind of things DO make future repairs hard, I`ve come across most of them..
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Nick Collis Bird

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Re: treble pallets
« Reply #25 on: November 29, 2012, 03:51:56 PM »

I was taught at college  regarding the restoration on anything NEVER to do anything irreversible.
  Anyway, I thing we are all disappearing up a gum tree here, pun intended.
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pikey

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Re: treble pallets
« Reply #26 on: November 29, 2012, 10:52:29 PM »

Use Wrigleys ?????   ;)
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Ebor_fiddler

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Re: treble pallets
« Reply #27 on: November 29, 2012, 11:27:59 PM »

Gum or Sisters?  ::)
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pikey

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Re: treble pallets
« Reply #28 on: November 30, 2012, 07:57:50 AM »

Bernard.
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an bosca ceoil

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Re: treble pallets
« Reply #29 on: December 02, 2012, 10:54:41 PM »

People are repairing and overhauling 120+ year old concertinas, so ease of reversal and removal should always be a consideration.

Absolutely right Malcolm , I dread to think what book restorers in a hundred years time will think of us after all the non- reversible PVA we have thrown around. Nearly all my restoration career I have only had to deal with animal glue, which is a doddle to remove.
During your restoration career have you ever been faced with removing the (hardened) adhesive residue left  when "repairs" have been done using old style (Elastoplast) sticking plaster?
Interested in finding anything that will soften it without damaging wood/paper substrates.
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Nick Collis Bird

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Re: treble pallets
« Reply #30 on: December 10, 2012, 07:22:14 PM »

People are repairing and overhauling 120+ year old concertinas, so ease of reversal and removal should always be a consideration.

Absolutely right Malcolm , I dread to think what book restorers in a hundred years time will think of us after all the non- reversible PVA we have thrown around. Nearly all my restoration career I have only had to deal with animal glue, which is a doddle to remove.
During your restoration career have you ever been faced with removing the (hardened) adhesive residue left  when "repairs" have been done using old style (Elastoplast) sticking plaster?
Interested in finding anything that will soften it without damaging wood/paper substrates.

Only just discovered this post. Sorry about the late reply.
For Elastoplast the answer is lighter fuel, otherwise known as Benzine. It is a banned substance  due to elf an safety, but a tin of lighter fuel will remove all those horrid sticky thing as well as Sellotape .
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Gandy

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Re: treble pallets
« Reply #31 on: December 15, 2012, 12:51:52 PM »

I was taught at college  regarding the restoration on anything NEVER to do anything irreversible.
  Anyway, I thing we are all disappearing up a gum tree here, pun intended.
I can't see why you'd consider it irreversible unless you want future restorers to be able to remove the felt without damage to the felt.  Nothing that's being discussed would stop the felt being renewed without damage to the pallets.  I think this is the difference from book restoration.

Tony S
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malcolmbebb

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Re: treble pallets
« Reply #32 on: December 15, 2012, 02:09:48 PM »

There were both general comments and specific comments in the thread. While pallets may not be a big deal, it's worth in general looking to the future.
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Dino BPII.
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Rob2Hook

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Re: treble pallets
« Reply #33 on: December 15, 2012, 04:18:36 PM »

I've never tried to remove all these various glues, but surely a contact adhesive will be harder to remove, but can be overcoated with fresh if a key is established?  Like wise, if PVA has been used, you can freshen the surface and use another coat on it.

Hope Lester had a good 60th birthday, mine coincided with our morris practice.  I arrived to find a "Happy Birthday" banner, cards, presents, bubbly and an iced cake with a remarkable model of my melodeon on it!

Rob.
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Nick Collis Bird

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Re: treble pallet
« Reply #34 on: December 16, 2012, 11:10:35 AM »

I've never tried to remove all these various glues, but surely a contact adhesive will be harder to remove, but can be overcoated with fresh if a key is established?  Like wise, if PVA has been used, you can freshen the surface and use another coat on it.

Hope Lester had a good 60th birthday, mine coincided with our morris practice.  I arrived to find a "Happy Birthday" banner, cards, presents, bubbly and an iced cake with a remarkable model of my melodeon on it!

Rob.

Many happy returns Birthday Boys. Welcome to God's waiting room.
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Matthew B

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Re: treble pallets
« Reply #35 on: December 18, 2012, 04:59:29 PM »

Brother, we're all in God's waiting room.  Though some of us may end up reading a few more of the outdated "Reader's Digests" than others. 
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Nick Collis Bird

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Re: treble pallets
« Reply #36 on: December 18, 2012, 06:09:06 PM »

Brother, we're all in God's waiting room.  Though some of us may end up reading a few more of the outdated "Reader's Digests" than others.

READERS DIGEST!
What's wrong with Melodeon Quarterly? Or "Squeeze My Box Bitch" weakly, sorry, weekly or even the Daily Mail article " My night of pain with a group of Melodeon players"? ( shock horror probe)
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