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Author Topic: Chanson  (Read 94481 times)

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malcolmbebb

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Re: Chanson
« Reply #40 on: January 05, 2013, 04:17:56 PM »

    Also I think we are guilty of major thread drift  :P

Au contraire. Bang on topic IMO.
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Dino BPII.
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EastAnglianTed

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Re: Chanson
« Reply #41 on: January 05, 2013, 04:30:30 PM »

    This topic really has really got me thinking. Even installing internal mics etc, if only for practice... >:E >:E
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911377brian

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Re: Chanson
« Reply #42 on: January 05, 2013, 04:33:28 PM »

It really does come down to procuring decent bellows, does'nt it? I would'nt know where to start searching. I bet someone on Melnet has the answer though. I've seen bellows advertised at arround £200:00, but that would just be silly. Would £ 50 be reasonable I wonder?All the quite expensive tiny boxes sound more like bat callers to me, whereas our little seven button toys can be made to sound quite wonderful with very little outlay.And I may have overplayed how air tight I made the belows.. Idid feel a little puff of air on my lip while playing this morning; perhaps I should have said ''airtight enough''...
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EastAnglianTed

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Re: Chanson
« Reply #43 on: January 05, 2013, 04:42:49 PM »

    The bellows, aye, they're the most important thing. See I don't know whether wrecking some if only to lay them out as templates for DIY'ing some is a good idea or not? Or can this be forwarded to a specialist? Too many questions....  :'(
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Nick Collis Bird

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Re: Chanson
« Reply #44 on: January 05, 2013, 04:54:17 PM »

    I'm a bit of a newbie when it comes to bellows, though I have been reading up on them. Is it essentially poor tape that stifens the cardboard 'skeleton'? If retaped and leathered on corners (both of which it needs) using cgm's stuff would it be a less creaky/leaky/squeaky set of bellows d'ya think?
    Also I think we are guilty of major thread drift  :P

Maybe not so much of a thread drift Ted as we are still talking about turning those toys into "real boxes"
The first set of bellows I made did not use creased cardboard but used strips of board hinged with leather, making the two long sides first and then the top and the bottom. Next was fitting the gussets to hold the thing together . THEN I discovered  my big mistake. I wanted to make the bellows indestructible , the boards I used were too heavy  and I put strips of steel rod in each crease. The box was playable but only if you were built like Tarzan. We mostly used it as a seat or a picnic bench. anyway I digress (as usual)
Back to your point. Charlie's , CGM  stuff can only improve what you have, the skill is in getting the leather thin enough ,it's amazingly  durable you could pare it almost to the point of seeing through it.
Obviously the better quality of tape will make things easier. I'm not sure whether a creased skeleton, as opposed to single boards would make a difference. I suppose it must do.
   If you need any more info Ted you can always PM me, or even talk to Malcolm Bebb, He's on the case ( not bellows, case geddit?)
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malcolmbebb

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Re: Chanson
« Reply #45 on: January 05, 2013, 04:57:31 PM »

The gussets were put on to the card; then the coloured papers (red/white on mine) were glued on; then the fabric bellows corners; finally the (on mine) red then blue bellows tape.

To replace the gussets you would need to reverse this: remove the bellows tape, corners, papers and finally the gussets.
In practice you'd maybe cut the papers, lose the corners (they leak anyway) and remove the gussets, although I have no idea what adhesive was used or how you'd release it.
Nick will advise on the leather for the gussets, although "Concertina Spares" or Charlie can sell you something suitable in small quantities.
You could perhaps buy metal corners of the right radius, maybe more cost than warranted, or bind them concertina style with ~1mm leather.

Posts crossed - sorry Nick, I AM on the bellows. And very close to literally so.

You'd need a simple jig to hold the bellows extended and to allow access to all corners. Doable, and easier than new bellows. Still a few dark winter nights to go. Probably therapeutic, too.
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Dino BPII.
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Nick Collis Bird

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Re: Chanson
« Reply #46 on: January 05, 2013, 05:02:16 PM »

Malcolm I know you are on the bellows. Yep you're on the case. Geddit?
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Has anyone heard of the song. “ Broken Alarm-clock Blues” ? It starts   “I woke up this Afternoon”

malcolmbebb

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Re: Chanson
« Reply #47 on: January 05, 2013, 05:29:06 PM »

No, No, Nick, the case is the LAST job. And if you really must know, I'm on the Speckled Hen.  :|glug
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Dino BPII.
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Theo

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Re: Chanson
« Reply #48 on: January 05, 2013, 06:04:20 PM »

Great little boxes these, I won one in a raffle at EATMT first time I went to melodeons and more.   They only need to be improved by replacing the leaky bellows, fitting some new action where the levers don't bend, oh and the reeds could do with replacing too, and then the child sized straps need an upgrade ...   but it is amazing how much fun they are. ;D
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malcolmbebb

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Re: Chanson
« Reply #49 on: January 05, 2013, 06:26:54 PM »

LOL nobody said upgrading them was a sensible idea!  ;D  Just another part of the fun.
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EastAnglianTed

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Re: Chanson
« Reply #50 on: January 05, 2013, 07:20:30 PM »

    Im completely taken in by the idea, already started!
    1st obstacle: stubborn screw. Soloution: dremelled out! I think I nearly set fire to the fingerboard with the heat however, still where would we be without a bit of drama?  8)
    Hopefully no more difficulties!  ;)
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Adam-T

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Re: Chanson
« Reply #51 on: January 05, 2013, 08:08:55 PM »

Wow, lotsa wood ! the ends of the modern ones are entirely plastic bar the reeds and action metalwork .. I`ll try and get a wooden one if I can find one .
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EastAnglianTed

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Re: Chanson
« Reply #52 on: January 05, 2013, 08:15:09 PM »

    The wood is pretty poor though, but still, I'm hoping a sand and a varnish will bring it up nicely >:E
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Nick Collis Bird

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Re: Chanson
« Reply #53 on: January 06, 2013, 03:19:18 PM »

    The wood is pretty poor though, but still, I'm hoping a sand and a varnish will bring it up nicely >:E
[/quote

I notice that you have a grey one there. Not a Soprani by any chance?
  Anyway, more to the point. How good was the woodwork and was it worth stripping of the celluloid?  The one I dug out of the shed is red. I'm just wondering if it's worth stripping. Keep me posted, our consortium is getting bigger.
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EastAnglianTed

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Re: Chanson
« Reply #54 on: January 06, 2013, 04:14:29 PM »

    Nope, not a soprano, its just a bog standard toy one, it does look grey in the light but its purple.
    I've had to stop for a few days now as I am flying to NIreland tommorow, then return the next day with a uni friend for a week (and I doubt he'd be interested in toy melodeon modifications. :P)
    I'll start again following the Straw Bear festival this coming weekend!
    And by the way guys, this site has ruined my revision timetable and Romeo and Juliet was read sporadically over a few days but it is one hell of a site!  >:E >:E >:E >:E
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EastAnglianTed

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Re: Chanson
« Reply #55 on: January 06, 2013, 04:19:24 PM »

    Oh and I'd say the wood is good enough. Not too sure what type it is (I know it isn't MDF  8)) and the build quality is substantial enough.
    The picture is actually the extent to which I have got to at the moment. I've stripped a little celluloid off and it seems to me like it will be an easy job (please god  ::))
    I'm looking forward to resuming soon. To keep myself busy after that I ordered this: http://www.carolenoakes.co.uk/market/bargains/BARG81.htm so I can't wait until I have plenty of free time  8)
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911377brian

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Re: Chanson
« Reply #56 on: January 06, 2013, 04:51:41 PM »

Nick, I know Ted should be answering your query, but having stripped one of its plastic here's my take on it, bearing in mind that I now have four to play with so a cockup is not the end of the world...The plastic comes off really easily, the wood is ok, but consists of various shades of ply which converge on the rounded out corners leaving a sort of end grain striation that is hard to disguise without filler.This means that the staining is a little uneven.A paint finish would be OK but pointless really,unless you're going for an unusual colour...
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EastAnglianTed

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Re: Chanson
« Reply #57 on: January 06, 2013, 05:08:57 PM »

    If you've done it before please tell us more  ;D
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911377brian

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Re: Chanson
« Reply #58 on: January 06, 2013, 05:47:15 PM »

Well, it started with a present that did'nt play very well, and as Microbot was bandoneonising my G box I sent the little mite off to him to fit Hohner reeds..then it all went a bit mad really,finding two more in Oxfam[£8 for two], fitting loads of unescessary brass strap hangers,stripping one down to wood, replacing as as many bits of plastic that would unscrew with cigar box wood...and of course making the bellows almost airtight with many coats of PVA in the gussets, joining two sets of bellows together [the luxury of having loads of spares] I feel a bit daft now I've written it down.And bugger me if someone has'nt given me ANOTHER one.... ???
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malcolmbebb

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Re: Chanson
« Reply #59 on: January 13, 2013, 11:41:20 PM »

Something upon which to repent at leisure.

http://melodeons-and-less.blogspot.co.uk/

Brian, if you're looking to rehome any.... ;)
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Dino BPII.
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