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Author Topic: Fingering help B/C  (Read 3175 times)

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hopey

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Fingering help B/C
« on: January 12, 2009, 08:27:22 PM »

Hello,
       In my practicing I'm often tempted (do in fact ) to move my 2 finger over my 1- say going from F# down to E. Less so ,but the same kind of move with my 3 crossing 2.
 If this is ok I don't mind practicing more, but at this stage I've a feeling it's not a smooth move.  Sometimes it seems the only way.
 What do you think?

PS. I'd like to thank Steve, George, Risto and Falseknight for getting back to me - it makes a big difference when you feel you can no longer think for yourself.
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risto

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Re: Fingering help B/C
« Reply #1 on: January 12, 2009, 11:50:52 PM »

Hopey, you could also start with tunes with fingerings. According to Steve the Damien Connelly DVD has 29 of them. Derek Hickey tutor also shows how to play the tunes. After that it will be much easier to do fingerings of your own.
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Stiamh

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Re: Fingering help B/C
« Reply #2 on: January 13, 2009, 01:50:55 AM »

I just tried this and realized it's something I never do, which surprised me, since I thought I had experimented with every possible fingering permutation in that "upper triangle"! Then I realized that the reason I don't do it is that on C#/D it equates to G# to F#, therefore not a common problem.

However I do use the same crossover (2 over 1, and even 3 over 1) in a very awkward spot on the C#/D, which is a sequence of notes d-cnat-A, which crops up a lot in some of my favourite reels in D-mix, D-minor and even some in G major (this would be equivalent to c-Bb-G on a B/C, not something you're likely to hit very often just yet). I used to finger this, and still do a lot of the time, 3-3-2, but because there are three bellows changes and two row crossings it is a very difficult passage to articulate cleanly at 120bpm +  (a lick at which some dance callers want our band to play).

Recently I discovered that using 3-1-2 seems to improve things somewhat, at the cost of a bit of a twist in the hand. It still seems a little awkward but in some tunes it seems the best choice - for now. (As I said in an earlier post, if your experience is anything like mine you'll be experimenting, discovering, refining and discarding for a long time.)

So I'd say practise it by all means, but look at every other way you might tackle the same passage, and practise those too!

Risto's idea makes sense - but I think it's all down to temperament. I enjoy being largely self-taught. Always on the lookout for tips from the more experienced, but I'd find it hard to follow anyone else's fingerings exactly. Nobody has the same shape and size hands and fingers...
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Stiamh

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Re: Fingering help B/C
« Reply #3 on: January 13, 2009, 01:53:36 AM »

PS Take courage, it does get easier with time. There is a point at which your fingers will start doing things automatically and, believe it or not, coming up with better solutions than those you have painstakingly worked out logically. The unconscious mind often knows best!
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risto

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Re: Fingering help B/C
« Reply #4 on: January 13, 2009, 10:15:48 AM »

John Williams crosses over the pinky with his middle finger in one of his C scale examples when going upwards. He says he took it from piano playing. In general, if you seem to end up in a difficult fingering situation it's worth examining how you got there. Perhaps there is something you can do before .

PS. I just decided that I will get the Connelly tutor to see what it is like (Steve's marketing technique works;-) ). Though self-experimenting is good of course, learning from experienced players is still the most reliable way and probably will save you a lot of unnecessary mileage and even from bad habbits.

PPS. "John Williams crosses over the pinky with his middle finger ..."  I have to check this when I get back home, I may have said wrong and it was with the ring finger.
« Last Edit: January 13, 2009, 11:28:21 AM by risto »
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Stiamh

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Re: Fingering help B/C
« Reply #5 on: January 13, 2009, 11:40:04 AM »

He does, Risto, and with the ring finger. This is what I described to Hopey in another thread except that - you know me - I cross 121 or 232, not 343 as you are describing here. But crossing over coming down the scale, which is what H is talking about here, feels considerably more awkward, to me anyway.

BTW John Williams is a very capable pianist and a great flute and whistle player too, and FWIW I think his concertina playing is better than his excellent accordion playing. I'm pretty sure he plays guitar, too - at least a guitarist friend of a friend was taking backup lessons from him!
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george garside

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Re: Fingering help B/C
« Reply #6 on: January 13, 2009, 06:45:20 PM »

as a very rough guiideline I find it easer to cross over going up (i.e down towards feet!) and to cross under when going down (i.e. up towards chin!)

an example of crossing under  would be    note  -  a b a g F# e d  as in harvest home
                                                         finger    1 2 1 1 3   2 1

the cross under being with finger 3 so that you finish the 'run' with first finger on d to start the  A part of the tune again.

the above applies to BC & BCC#

george

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risto

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Re: Fingering help B/C
« Reply #7 on: January 14, 2009, 12:48:57 AM »

He does, Risto, and with the ring finger.

Yes, he does indeed. I found it from the chapter where he shows the D scale, not C scale as I said previously.

Quote
BTW John Williams is a very capable pianist and a great flute and whistle player too, and FWIW I think his concertina playing is better than his excellent accordion playing. I'm pretty sure he plays guitar, too - at least a guitarist friend of a friend was taking backup lessons from him!

No wonder if he does. He is also a very friendly person. Before I knew anything about B/C accordions I by accident found his web page and posted some questions. He send me an email and gave a good explanation of what a B/C accordion is.
« Last Edit: January 14, 2009, 12:51:43 AM by risto »
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Stiamh

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Re: Fingering help B/C
« Reply #8 on: January 14, 2009, 02:30:05 AM »

as a very rough guiideline I find it easer to cross over going up (i.e down towards feet!) and to cross under when going down (i.e. up towards chin!)

an example of crossing under  would be    note  -  a b a g F# e d  as in harvest home
                                                         finger    1 2 1 1 3   2 1

the cross under being with finger 3 so that you finish the 'run' with first finger on d to start the  A part of the tune again.

the above applies to BC & BCC#

george

Neat trick, George, thanks!

The way I have been playing that sequence (actually in a tune in A maj on C#/D, but exactly the same sequence of buttons) was by crossing over, like this:

A B A G F# E D
1 2 1 2 1   2 1

This works well for me but your way is very easy too. It's great to have an alternative up your sleeve - you try it a few times - sort of set it out for the unconscious mind to chew on and before you know it the fingers just start doing it in places where it will work better  :)
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