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Author Topic: Using "true" ♯/♭ characters on melnet  (Read 6844 times)

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Etienne

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Re: Using "true" ♯/♭ characters on melnet
« Reply #20 on: July 13, 2013, 11:39:27 AM »

Google google .. it appears we'll also need à, á, è, é, ì, ò, ó and ù  ::)
And all those fancy nordic letters with ° and / on them, and ß, and this inversed ^accent for czech that they put on strange letters like "C" and "S", and i can't remember wich language use cedillas under the "S"...

About the ñ that is spannish, I don't understand why I can do this easily on my french keyboard while write œ or æ is nearly impossible. >:(
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GPS

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Re: Using "true" ♯/♭ characters on melnet
« Reply #21 on: July 13, 2013, 01:00:03 PM »

and this inversed ^accent for czech that they put on strange letters like "C" and "S",

It's called a haček.  Very handy if you want to discuss a Hlavaček squeezebox.... ;)
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Chris Ryall

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Re: Using "true" ♭ ♮ ♯ characters on melnet
« Reply #22 on: July 13, 2013, 01:18:50 PM »

All entirely do-able now that the forum is properly coded in UTF-8  ;D as indeed all the skittish posts above have shown. I'm actually little concerned about the minutiae of European language, or their various jots and tittles. Most non English words chez moi get a quick google and are then pasted over. There are also thousands of them;  any look up table would be groaning!

Just sort of wanted ♭ ♮ ♯, we are a musical forum after all
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Etienne

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Re: Using "true" ♯/♭ characters on melnet
« Reply #23 on: July 13, 2013, 01:37:28 PM »

It's called a haček.  Very handy if you want to discuss a Hlavaček squeezebox.... ;)
Aaah, an old Hlavaček, something that may push me off the Hohner world...
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Lester

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Re: Using "true" ♭ ♮ ♯ characters on melnet
« Reply #24 on: July 13, 2013, 01:39:41 PM »

we are a musical forum after all

No were aren't we play melodeons  >:E

Anahata

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Re: Using "true" ♯/♭ characters on melnet
« Reply #25 on: July 13, 2013, 01:41:06 PM »

See Anahata has posted as I type ;D now, why would he want a Welsh character?  >:E

Point taken, I'm married to one  ;D

I discovered the Ŵ problem when trying to ABC a Welsh Song that had one of those in the title.  abcm2ps (or rather Postscript itself) only supports Latin-1.
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Theo

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Re: Using "true" ♯/♭ characters on melnet
« Reply #26 on: July 15, 2013, 12:17:55 PM »


I still think that the # b and EUR work just fine but this SMF mod might do what you guys are talking about.

http://custom.simplemachines.org/mods/index.php?mod=3054

Just tried installing this, and have taken it off again.  In order to choose the characters we want, instead of the ones that it wants, you have to produce new images for buttons to appear in the editor, and you have to recode the mod to include the new characters.  Sorry, I don't have time to do that.
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oolong32

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Re: Using "true" ♯/♭ characters on melnet
« Reply #27 on: July 15, 2013, 02:47:54 PM »

How about including special characters somewhere in the source text for the "post reply" form? E.g. there is already a line saying

Code: [Select]
<p class="smalltext" id="shortcuts">shortcuts: hit shift+alt+s to submit/post or shift+alt+p to preview</p>
This could be changed to
Code: [Select]
<p class="smalltext" id="shortcuts">shortcuts: hit shift+alt+s to submit/post or shift+alt+p to preview
<br />
special characters: ♩ ♪ ♫ ♬ ♭ ♮ ♯</p>

Then we could copy-paste them when required.
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♭ ♮ ♯

Chris Ryall

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Re: Using "true" ♯/♭ characters on melnet
« Reply #28 on: July 15, 2013, 03:45:16 PM »

Agree, a simple line of UTF-8 text on the page that carries the edit box would suffice. In essence I've long done this myself by having a separate text editor window open, fancy characters* kept in there.  Is the page configurable?
*characters posting to this forum not included ;)


 
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GPS

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Re: Using "true" ♯/♭ characters on melnet
« Reply #29 on: July 15, 2013, 03:48:41 PM »

It's called a haček.  Very handy if you want to discuss a Hlavaček squeezebox.... ;)
Aaah, an old Hlavaček, something that may push me off the Hohner world...

Me too - I'm going back to Prague in a couple of weeks for the first time in a few years; I'm guessing the prices of old boxes will have risen alarmingly, but I'll be on the look out...
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Squeezing in the Cyprus sunshine

Theo

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Re: Using "true" ♯/♭ characters on melnet
« Reply #30 on: July 15, 2013, 05:03:59 PM »

How about including special characters somewhere in the source text for the "post reply" form? E.g. there is already a line saying

Code: [Select]
<p class="smalltext" id="shortcuts">shortcuts: hit shift+alt+s to submit/post or shift+alt+p to preview</p>
This could be changed to
Code: [Select]
<p class="smalltext" id="shortcuts">shortcuts: hit shift+alt+s to submit/post or shift+alt+p to preview
<br />
special characters: ♩ ♪ ♫ ♬ ♭ ♮ ♯</p>

Then we could copy-paste them when required.

Problem with hacking the forum code is that the next update may remove it.
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Theo Gibb - Gateshead UK

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squeezy

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Re: Using "true" ♯/♭ characters on melnet
« Reply #31 on: July 23, 2013, 01:11:03 AM »

I don't accept the "no change needed" voices on this thread. Had we followed such wisdom there would have been no Melnet, maybe no Internet? This technology is now mature and I'd suggest we take advantage of it. But in a way advantageous to the forum.

At the risk of following a set pattern - I completely disagree with you Chris ... again!

Having a completely correct sharp and flat character available at great inconvenience to the mods here rather than just using # and b like every normal person would - because they looks just like a flat and sharp sign and everyone can understand how to do it from their keyboard ... would be a frankly very anal way to go!

It is absolutely nothing like what happened when I started melodeon.net - I started it because a whole world full of players of a similar instrument didn't communicate and I wanted them to do so because I thought it would enrich the whole specialist community given that nothing on the net existed like that before.  For purely selfish reasons of course as I love melodeons!

There is a massive difference between that and the bizarre request you have made to create a lot of work by the great unpaid to make the forum have a designated way of producing the correct sharp and flat notation when one already exists on everyone's keyboards that everyone understands.

I hope that makes sense!

Squeezy
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Squeezy

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squeezy

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Re: Using "true" ♯/♭ characters on melnet
« Reply #32 on: July 23, 2013, 01:16:29 AM »

And Chris - you seem to be able to post ♭ ♮ and ♯ here as far as I can see from your posts above - without any forum intervention ... so what exactly is the problem?
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Chris Ryall

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Re: Using "true" ♯/♭ characters on melnet
« Reply #33 on: July 23, 2013, 06:56:26 AM »

oh dear  ::) No request has yet been made.

Feel free to actually read the thread from its inception. I tried to post an entirely open question and, I hope, then allowed an open discussion to develop. In this I listened to the points everyone has made, for or against. I learned several things as it went along.

Internet implementation issues do  tend to be platform specific, and if as Theo suggests, group related  tweaks tend to be wiped out by updates … hmmm, big negative. With SMF's somewhat basic search facility also compromised, it looks to me that the technology isn't ready?

Actually I personally decided to let it rest at that point and haven't been here for over a week. To be fair to the forum's volunteers (I'm uncertain if that includes yourself) I have done several voluntary/unpaid roles myself and am well sensitive to what is involved.

Yes, one can copy and paste, but it gets a bit onerous. With a comprehensive modern font system now installed here, (and on most people's browsers) it seems to me slightly Luddite ("anal" might offend) to oppose change simply … because it might change things?  I know someone up at w3.org HQ (he's an excellent melodeon player!). The internet journey is only half made; you'd be amazed at some of the things in their ideas pipeline!

Sorry to have to respond in this way, but I honestly felt this idea had petered out, and done so quite naturally. Should anything similar come up in the future I'd encourage you to contribute to discussion as it happens, and as an equal partner, rather than come in and (sorry, but as this is "again") assert propriatorial rights.

Should this rather be a personal matter, well there is PM for that, or email, or phone, or even "over a pint" :D   Chris


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Nick Collis Bird

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Re: Using "true" ♯/♭ characters on melnet
« Reply #34 on: July 23, 2013, 07:21:47 AM »

Scottish rules are written in schist and gneiss. Metamorphic rocks are changed by extreme heat and pressure.

Igneous !   :D
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Theo

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Re: Using "true" ♯/♭ characters on melnet
« Reply #35 on: July 23, 2013, 08:47:39 AM »


 request you have made to create a lot of work by the great unpaid

My policy on wish list requests is that they all get looked at carefully. Simple and obvious improvements are implemented promptly.  Anything that requires significant work is only likely to be acted on if there is great wave of enthusiasm from many members.  This suggestion has not met any of those criteria, and as you point out Squeezy, there are keyboard shortcuts available for those who wish to use true" ♯/♭ symbols.
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