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[jerfish]

Hello!  I'm new here and 1 week into my new hobby.  I live in Upstate NY, where everyone who plays accordion appears to play the piano accordion (no live instruction is available, alas).  I have a multitude of books (my accordion is a GCF, focusing on GC for now, may pick up a box more English tuned DG at some point when I want to try that style - I'm currently on a French kick!), have been looking online, and generally am fumbling about (the Pignol and Milleret french diatonic methode has been the most helpful thus far).

Any recommendations for us loners?  I may take a dive into the online Italian 15 lesson course (http://www.organetto.info/overview_eng.htm)

Also, and I know I"m opening up a common debate, should I be trying to learn the notation or just look at the push/pull numbers?  I can read music a bit but not sure which I should look at more (I find the numbers so far much easier in the beginning).  Renaming do re me fa so la.... from CGABDE has been an interesting change as well, but do I need to do that if I just look at numbers?

[MichaelM]

Hi Jerfish. welcome to the forum. There are others more experienced than I to offer guidance, but to help you advance in the French repertoire you might find Bernard Loffet's website useful. It's in both English and French: http://diato.org/home_eng.htm
Click on partitions et tablatures. This is only one of many resources available, including many on this site and on Youtube.
If you are self-teaching (and you can go a long way by this method) you'll find it helpful to learn to read music. That's only my personal opinon. Plenty of people advocate learning by ear alone.
Best of luck. I know what it's like learning in isolation. I live in rural western Canada and I have yet to meet another diatonic accordionist in these parts.
Michael

[Graham Spencer]

Hi and welcome. Like everyone else, I can only give my personal opinion from my own experience. Plenty of people will disagree with me, and you'll soon discover that there is no right and wrong with the diatonic accordion. Now personally I have no clue about the number of the button I'm pressing or which way the bellows is going; I learned purely from picking the instrument up and discovering what it did. I have great admiration for players who can analyse which fingers they're using, which button they're pressing and what the bellows is doing for every note; I just play tunes! 

I have no idea whether reading music is an aid or a hindrance to learning the melodeon; I could already read music before I picked up the box, but I don't recall using that knowledge until much later, when I began to learn tunes from the written page rather than by ear. I realise this post isn't actually very helpful, except to advise you not to get too hung up on the "best" or the "right" way to learn. The best and the right way is the way that works for you; if you are of an analytical turn of mind then there are systems that will probably be of help to you, but if, like me, you are an intuitive player those systems are more likely to frustrate you. FWIW, I've never had a formal melodeon lesson in my life, nor have I ever opened a tutor book. Sure, I've learned an awful lot from other players, and still continue to do so after 30-odd years of playing. Whatever you decide, best of luck and I'm sure you will get lots of support from melnet.

Graham

[ButtonBox21]

Welcome to the group. If you decide to try Irish music then I highly recommend John Nolan in Nanuet, NY. His web site is www.accordionwizard.com. He might be able to help you with French music. He also sells and repairs button accordions. He is an awesome accordion player.

[nathen]

Hi there jerfish, welcome onboard, be prepared for a great cruise across the sunny ocean of magical melodion melodies. Like yourself,  I have just joined the forum and am only a couple of weeks into playing the diatonic melodion, a Hohner Corona GCF. So I'm basically in the same boat a you regarding  playing the melodion.

I've come from playing the piano accordion for a couple of years, and the piano for umpteen years before that. However, as soon as I picked up a diatonic I fell in love with it and have now switched over to the melodion (love that word).

Personally, I think a combination of playing by ear and reading music is the best way I have found for self-expression in music. Bear in mind I am only talking about myself, any decision or direction you take will be perfect. Each of us has our own path to wander down. However, ideas and pointers from other fellow music makers can be helpful.

Playing by ear helps you to feel out the instrument instinctively, and allows complete freedom to explore without any limitations. My first instrument was a mouth organ at ten which I played by ear for ten years. We also had a piano at home which I played by ear.  My father was a pop piano player, no he didn't give me any lessons, so Listening to him I got a sense of the music.

Later in life I became a band teacher in the public school system, and I found being able to read music a quick way of learning tunes. However, once I get the basic tune down I soon dump the music and make it my own interpretation according to how I feel in any given moment.

I'm going to take some lessons from Gary Chapin on the forum because he plays the music I want to play. I would be really interested to know if you take that online italian course, I think I'd like to try it as well.

Although I live in a large city, Vancouver, Canada, I haven't yet met any diatonic players here. Although I'm sure I will as soon as I get going on my button box. They'll just hear me playing in the nearby park and crawl out of the woodwork; drawn like bees to honey. Yeah, right, or run for cover!

Enjoy the journey jerfish, it's a wonderful path.

Nathen

[Sebastian]

any decision or direction you take will be perfect.

Speaking strictly only of myself: No, not every decision or direction I took was perfect.

[nathen]

I understand what you are saying here Sebastion, but what I should have said was, perfect for your growth. Many of the decisions I have made in my life had horrendous results, and caused me a lot of pain and hardship. However, looking back, I see they allowed me to mature and be able to make better decisions for myself. In that regard were they perfect. I didn't mean necessarily enjoyable!

By the way Sebastion, thanks for pointing out the video clip on the use of the air button, I found it really helpful.

Nathen

[Thrupenny Bit]

Hiya, welcome!
I struggled and persevered reading music on melodeon, and now nearly 4 years on am glad for that perseverance. I feel it has paid off. I also can and do play by ear.
I can sight read the notes so I know which note to play, and listen to get the right length and expression on it.
Reading music at a basic level helps me to understand which bass to put with a melody note, so I know what's going on with my left hand.
I also found printing off a keyboard layout for my box a help initially so I knew where the notes could be found.
Others May or may not agree ... But that's what helped me.
Good luck!
Q

[Suppards]

I am struggling and persevering to read dots at the moment.  It is hard work just at the time when I thought learning to play the box was, in itself, hard enough.  I am at the stage where the music notation helps me to play all the notes and in the right order (mostly!) but I still need to hear a tune played in order to get how it should actually sound.  Getting that from the stave eludes me at my present stage of conscious incompetence but maybe it will come in time.

Anyway, and in a nutshell, I agree with Thrupenny Bit in that, in the long run,  I think it is worthwhile learning to read music.

[911377brian]

An old time guitar player from the Delta, when asked if he read the dots is said to have replied, after giving it some thought ''Well, not so as it interferes with the music''....

[Sage Herb]

Often attributed to Chet Atkins, but there may well be others.

Cheers
Steve

[Howard Jones]

I still need to hear a tune played in order to get how it should actually sound.  Getting that from the stave eludes me

I'm not sure that standard musical notation can ever convey that.  It shows what notes are to be played - how they are to be played requires an understanding of the genre, which can only be gained by a lot of listening.  This is why attempts by very good musicians to play in unfamiliar genres so often sounds a bit clunky - Yehudi Menuhin attempting to play jazz violin with Stephane Grappelli always comes to my mind as an example of this.  It also explains why folk tunes are often dismissed because on the page they look so simple - the nuances don't come across in the notation.

[george garside]

I can read the music for any tune I already know! 

george

[Anahata]

I am at the stage where the music notation helps me to play all the notes and in the right order (mostly!) but I still need to hear a tune played in order to get how it should actually sound.

There are two distinct stages to this.

First, on a purely practical level, the hardest problem people have with reading music is not the pitches of the notes, which at least have some correlation with how high or low they are on the stave, but reading rhythms, which are indicated purely symbolically, so guesswork is out of the question and you have to learn them. Of course if you can only play the pitches and don't have the rhythm, you don't really know "how a tune goes". Learning to read rhythm is hard work; it just takes lots of practice but you'll get there.

Second: if you use something like a MIDI player, (e.g. if you have ABC notation, you can get some programs to play a tune through a synthesiser) that will play the right rhythm, but it still won't be musical. That's where you should be able to step in and play it so it doesn't sound like a machine.
The second stage is more subtle, because the notation doesn't help you any more, and you're moving into interpretation (baroque/classical/romantic vs. jazz, regional styles of folk music etc.) which can only be learned by listening to others.

[george garside]

 not only listening to others but also and just as importantly listening to  whats coming out of your own box  to make sure it is 'fit for purpose'  rather  than relying on 'its ok 'cos I am playing whats writ!'

george

[911377brian]

You're right, Steve; Just found the quote attributed to Chet in a banjo instruction book of all places...

[Sage Herb]

You're right, Steve; Just found the quote attributed to Chet in a banjo instruction book of all places...

Apparently Chet took up the banjo quite late in his career - have a look at this gem: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tef-6HEcgOw

cheers
Steve

[Suppards]

Thank you Anahata  - that's really helpful stuff.   

[Sage Herb]

I still need to hear a tune played in order to get how it should actually sound.  Getting that from the stave eludes me

I'm not sure that standard musical notation can ever convey that.  It shows what notes are to be played - how they are to be played requires an understanding of the genre, which can only be gained by a lot of listening.  This is why attempts by very good musicians to play in unfamiliar genres so often sounds a bit clunky - Yehudi Menuhin attempting to play jazz violin with Stephane Grappelli always comes to my mind as an example of this.  It also explains why folk tunes are often dismissed because on the page they look so simple - the nuances don't come across in the notation.

Howard is right that understanding the genre is critical to playing the music. That's why teaching approaches such as Gav Atkins' Traditional Music Classes (http://www.singdanceandplay.net/free-traditional-music-classes-at-the-gun-and-spitroast-horsmonden/) are so valuable.
Cheers
Steve

[911377brian]

In danger of chronic thread drift, but thanks for the Dolly/Chet clip Steve, a real joy..