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Author Topic: Mason's Apron part B  (Read 2016 times)

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Boyen

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Mason's Apron part B
« on: April 11, 2015, 09:43:15 PM »

Just looking for some tips on how to play this part fluently on the button box (c#/d if it matters), or how to practice to get the sound that I want.
When I listen to recordings, especially from fiddles, or people at my session (usually also fiddles) on this tune I hear pretty much this:
https://app.box.com/s/7j0ela6gnyiwxsgmeya7ej4mof47ka3m

In abc something along the lines of:
|:ed|c2e2 f2e2|c2e2 fedc|d2f2 a2f2|defg afed|
c2e2 f2e2|EFAc dcBA|d2dc defa|A2 cB A2:|

When playing the ABC on the session here:
|:ed|cAeA fAeA|cAeA fedc|dBfB aBfB|defg afed|
cAeA fAeA|EFAc dcBA|d2dc defa|A2 cB A2:|

It comes out as this:
https://app.box.com/s/5bz7kjvxksdadvvl7kdsu3ks0pn15n8m

My ears just don't seem to correspond with the notes, but I'm also quite sure that I shouldn't be playing it without the "drone" notes in between. I actually had the same problem with Drowsy Maggie and Gravel Walks but I've seem to have come to terms with those by just playing it faster, but I still hear those "drone notes" quite clearly compared to many of the recordings I listen to.

What are people doing with those drone notes to the point that you barely hear them and how could I emulate that in my playing on the box? Is it a matter of practicing emphasis when playing slow and then just speeding up?
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John MacKenzie (Cugiok)

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Re: Mason's Apron part B
« Reply #1 on: April 11, 2015, 09:58:01 PM »

This how I've always known it to be played.

John


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mtSjM3YU7Qw
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Boyen

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Re: Mason's Apron part B
« Reply #2 on: April 11, 2015, 10:29:12 PM »

@John That clip pretty much confirms what I'm saying or am I hearing it wrong?
https://youtu.be/mtSjM3YU7Qw?t=53s
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TomB

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Re: Mason's Apron part B
« Reply #3 on: April 11, 2015, 11:05:25 PM »

If you look at version 7 (severn) on the SessionDotOrg, that is pretty much the basic tune that will be played by most Irish players, although there are so many variations, as illustrated on TheSession, that it's rarely heard in Irish sessions unless someone wants to play it as a 'party piece'. Just go with the flow and play the same notes as the other musicians in the group, there's no right or wrong way, just different.
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Boyen

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Re: Mason's Apron part B
« Reply #4 on: April 12, 2015, 09:20:58 AM »

Tom, thanks but my problem is not that I don't know which version to play.

The problem is that I know everyone plays a constant drone note on the B part ie:
|:ed|cAeA fAeA|cAeA (The A note)
dBfB aBfB| (the B note)

But I hear it played as (https://app.box.com/s/7j0ela6gnyiwxsgmeya7ej4mof47ka3m):
|:ed|c2e2 f2e2|c2e2 and
d2f2 a2f2|

In the youtube link posted at 53 seconds I do not hear these drone notes played, yet I am fairly sure he does play them. When I do play them it sounds like this: https://app.box.com/s/5bz7kjvxksdadvvl7kdsu3ks0pn15n8m which resembles the written version but the drone notes appear too obvious for my ear. As such my question is, how do I make those note silenced as everyone else seems to be doing.
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TomB

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Re: Mason's Apron part B
« Reply #5 on: April 12, 2015, 03:44:17 PM »

Your version sounds fine to me but if you want it to sound a bit different, try putting more emphasis on the upper notes (C# E F#) and play the A notes very staccato. There's various versions by box players on YouTube, pick any one you like for a bit of inspiration.
Here is a nice clear rendering   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8DqQwPDujbk   with lots of variants.
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GPS

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Re: Mason's Apron part B
« Reply #6 on: April 12, 2015, 04:06:06 PM »

Your version sounds fine to me but if you want it to sound a bit different, try putting more emphasis on the upper notes (C# E F#) and play the A notes very staccato. There's various versions by box players on YouTube, pick any one you like for a bit of inspiration.
Here is a nice clear rendering   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8DqQwPDujbk   with lots of variants.

I'm not sure I'd call that a "clear" rendering, but I really enjoyed it. I confess I've not come across Grace Dowling before, but she has a really "lifty" style that has both Irish and English characteristics and it's really "dancy", so thanks for that link. Unusual that she's making full use of the bass end - is that a semitone box she's playing?

Graham
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TomB

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Re: Mason's Apron part B
« Reply #7 on: April 12, 2015, 09:31:11 PM »

It looks like a C#D, the same as Boyen's box, thats why I chose it. Maybe 'clear' wasn't a good choice of word, it's just that some recordings on YouTube are over complicated and I felt this recording could give a better insight on how it sounds on a box, rather than flute or fiddle, etc.
« Last Edit: April 13, 2015, 02:14:16 AM by TomB »
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gettabettabox

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Re: Mason's Apron part B
« Reply #8 on: April 12, 2015, 09:46:50 PM »

B/C
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boxcall

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Re: Mason's Apron part B
« Reply #9 on: April 12, 2015, 09:54:36 PM »

Boyen said he plays or is learning this on C#/D.

edited to add:
I like the way it sounded on your second clip / with drones.
« Last Edit: April 12, 2015, 09:57:17 PM by boxcall »
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brazilian.BOX

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Re: Mason's Apron part B
« Reply #10 on: April 12, 2015, 10:21:47 PM »

Here is a nice clear rendering   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8DqQwPDujbk   

Amazing this song. But someone talk to this guy at the extreme left in this video, have COURAGE and use one drum part like this here in black please www.youtube.com/watch?v=lXMCcUVUgbI

ahahahhahah  :|glug >:E



And TomB, this avatar yours, is really beautiful. I am always paying special attention on it. ;)
« Last Edit: April 12, 2015, 10:23:46 PM by brazilian.BOX »
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TomB

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Re: Mason's Apron part B
« Reply #11 on: April 13, 2015, 02:21:55 AM »

B/C


Well spotted!  I just assumed Grace Dowling was playing the tune in the key of A  :|bl
I agree it's probably a BC box played in G.
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Stiamh

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Re: Mason's Apron part B
« Reply #12 on: April 13, 2015, 12:42:27 PM »

...am I hearing it wrong?

I think you are. The notes you are talking about, which aren't exactly drones (you could call them pedal notes), are essential. You must play them. This is not negotiable. Leaving them out and playing the three upper notes as quarter notes/crotchets will kill the tune stone dead. Don't even think about doing that!

Now you can try various things to bring out the top notes and minimize the bottom ones: accenting, as Tom said above. Or doing what Grace Dowling does, using the C# as the pedal in the A phrases (in her case B pedal in the G phrases), which would allow you to play the entire pedal phrase on the pull. (Although I have to say I think that sounds a wee bit cheesy.)

You can also vary the tune in such a way that these notes are avoided. For example, fiddler Paddy Killoran recorded a lovely version (later taken up by Kevin Burke and hence quite well known in session circles) that avoids the B pedal note in the second part 3rd and 4th bars.

Starting at 2:08 in this video https://youtu.be/EopvuL9T8W4 you will hear Brian Rooney playing his own great variations on the Paddy Killoran version, frequently avoiding the pedal notes. But when he plays something close to the the standard A phrase, the A pedal notes are there.

Ultimately phrases like this show (another of) the limitations of the DBA when it comes to sounding like a fiddle. I wouldn't worry about it - as Tom says, your rendition is on the right track. Keep playing all the notes, and if you keep the sound you are after in your mind, I think your hands and arms will find a way of getting closer to it without your having to agonize about it.

BTW late last night I wrote a reply without reading your questions carefully first. Deleted it because it was off-course rather. Sorry if any of you read it.

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Boyen

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Re: Mason's Apron part B
« Reply #13 on: April 13, 2015, 01:17:49 PM »

Interesting! Grace uses another note there? Considering I barely hear the note played, I would never have caught that.
I saw in your video Steve that Kevin Burke mixed the C part described on the session with the B Part (x=1). this is a way to go but feels a bit like cheating... I don't want to walk away from the problem, I want to do it properly.

This accenting is really hard for me, especially when I need to speed it up, most people play this tune crazy fast. I'll just need to accept that I'm not ready for that yet I guess.

Apologies for my phrasing of the questions... It's hard to put thoughts about music on paper for me. Thanks everyone for the help.
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Stiamh

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Re: Mason's Apron part B
« Reply #14 on: April 13, 2015, 01:28:23 PM »

Interesting! Grace uses another note there?

At 0:34 - 0:38.
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