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Author Topic: Button lever hinge?  (Read 2557 times)

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Winston Smith

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Button lever hinge?
« on: March 23, 2016, 09:08:08 AM »

Being in yet a bit more trouble, I turn again to the experts on here.

I'm into my National Band 3 stopper with a touch of gusto and my usual bravado! The sound board had many cracks between the holes, where the edges of the cracks were standing proud of the face. I filed these down, then filed the cracks out and filled them with (modern) Polyfilla before filing the whole surface flat again. It feels OK, so I'm reasonably happy with that part.
However, the button action was very uneven and a bit sticky here and there. When I got a good look at it, I came across 12 hairpins shoved onto the doings to act as helper springs, but after removing them, it seemed that they hadn't actually been accomplishing anything at all. The hinge has a slight coating if rust and none of the levers move smoothly, I haven't yet destroyed the hinge (although it has bent a bit) but am having difficulty in finding something with which to replace it.
Measured with my brand new Workzone (from Aldi at only £7.99!) digital Vernier caliper; it's 1.11mm or 44 thou. Thinking that this size was rather strange, I looked up the measurements of wire gauges, which (of course) didn't compare. Yesterday afternoon was spent trailing around various friend's businesses measuring welding rods and argon arc wires etc., all to no avail. Number One Son even brought some wire from work, which was supposed to be 1mm but ended up being .97 and flopping about in the lever arm!

I'm almost certain that other Melnetters will have come across this self-same problem, so; anyone out there with a solution? Please?
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Steve_freereeder

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Re: Button lever hinge?
« Reply #1 on: March 23, 2016, 09:38:46 AM »

On the melodeon building courses, Emmanuel Pariselle uses (I believe) bicycle spokes for his axle rods.

Here's a source.

These are slightly wider in diameter than you are looking for, but you should be able to ream out the axle hole in the pallet arm levers to take the new size.
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triskel

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Re: Button lever hinge?
« Reply #2 on: March 23, 2016, 10:12:10 AM »

On the melodeon building courses, Emmanuel Pariselle uses (I believe) bicycle spokes for his axle rods.

I've used one to replace the rod in a Klingenthal box before now. In fact I started out using it as a drift to tap the old rod out, and finished up leaving it there...

Winston Smith

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Re: Button lever hinge?
« Reply #3 on: March 23, 2016, 11:59:54 AM »

Thanks for that suggestion Mr freereeder, and Mr triskel.
Funnily enough, I've just measured a bike spoke which I keep under the sink for hooking hair out of the bath drain! (But it's well bent, b****r!) Never mind, though, I had thought of using something a bit bigger (I've got a couple of welding rods hidden away in my cupboard somewhere) but I'm a bit wary of trying to enlarge the slots in the keyboard in case I make a mess of it, also the levers aren't all that thick and I'd hate to weaken them too much. I'll have another look after the Missus has finished with me.
Thanks again chaps!
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Winston Smith

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Re: Button lever hinge?
« Reply #4 on: March 23, 2016, 12:56:27 PM »

Right then, whilst the scampi is in the oven, I've just been and found the two bits of welding rod, the shorter of which is 1.6mm. So far; so good! The question now is where to find a 1.6mm  drill bit to open out the holes (without having to buy a boxful!) and what to use to widen the slot where the axle goes? (I know that's two questions, but I used to be in the Spanish Inquisition, so I thought you might let me off, and the first one was rhetorical anyway.)
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Broadland Boy

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Re: Button lever hinge?
« Reply #5 on: March 23, 2016, 01:20:47 PM »

'The Hooded Nipper strikes again' a Tyneside SPOKEsperson reported, following further nocturnal raids on unattended cycles....... ;)

Spoke material varied in diameter, tandem spokes tending to be thicker than 'ordinary' and that thicker than for racing cycles, what sort of size range is readily available these days I don't know but a local repair shop or bike club would.
Gas welding rod (mild steel) down to 1.6mm or 1/16" and (brass) brazing rod is widely available at 1.6 or 2.4 mm dia and being drawn these are generally pretty straight out of the box.

You could drawfile the larger material down - start with a longer than needed bit, clamp on a bit of wood strip and file longwise with the file across the rod - so the file is operating sideways, push it along the rod a stroke or two then rotate a bit until the new Windy Nook Metrology Division gives the thumbs up  (:)
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Kimric Smythe

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Re: Button lever hinge?
« Reply #6 on: March 24, 2016, 06:43:37 AM »

If you are going to rebore,use the new rod as a drill and give the tip a cutting edge groove. No need for a special drill.
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Winston Smith

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Re: Button lever hinge?
« Reply #7 on: March 24, 2016, 09:39:23 AM »

Thanks, Kimric, I should have thought of that myself, after all, there's only about a half millimetre to take out. But that still leaves the problem of the slots. I imagine that an attempt to use sandpaper would result in a "V" shaped slot with the hinge not securely held in place?
Not forgetting Richard, of course, ever whys!
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Steve_freereeder

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Re: Button lever hinge?
« Reply #8 on: March 24, 2016, 10:39:24 AM »

But that still leaves the problem of the slots. I imagine that an attempt to use sandpaper would result in a "V" shaped slot with the hinge not securely held in place?

I'm a bit wary of trying to enlarge the slots in the keyboard in case I make a mess of it, also the levers aren't all that thick and I'd hate to weaken them too much.

I'm not quite sure what you are referring to by the 'slots'. A photo or two would really help us understand your problem.

(1) If you are referring to a covered groove that the axle runs in, then using the new axle as a drill like Kimric suggests should cope with that.

(2) However, if you mean the larger cut-out slots which the key levers sit in, then they ought to be pretty much the right width to begin with unless humidity changes have caused the wood to swell slightly, leading to some binding.

If it is (2) then don't try to enlarge the slot. I would recommend very light sanding of the sides of lever arms. Presumably you have removed them...?  Use very fine (600 grade) carborundum sheet, taped to a flat work top and rub the sides of the lever arm very gently, testing each one for fit in the slot. There should be no binding but neither should there be any wobbling. When the fit is nearly right, burnish the sides of the lever arms by rubbing directly on a flat smooth work top with no carborundum sheet, followed up by rubbing the sides with graphite (ideally, locksmiths' powdered graphite) but failing that, a soft pencil, e.g. 2B or softer.
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Re: Button lever hinge?
« Reply #9 on: March 24, 2016, 12:10:08 PM »

Yes, of course! Pictures are always a good start, thanks Steve. Although, I dropped my International off with Theo, this morning, and he might have a remedy for me, fingers crossed.

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Re: Button lever hinge?
« Reply #10 on: March 24, 2016, 01:52:16 PM »

OK - pictures are good! Now I understand what you mean by the slot. Not all instruments have such a deep slot as yours, and many have a bored hole for the axle, not a slot.

So - referring to my earlier post, it's (1). I would use the new axle rod to enlarge the slot at its base just enough so it is a snug fit. It does not need to rotate, in fact it's better if it doesn't. It is the lever arms which pivot on the axle, not the axle rotating. Drill/rotate the axle in carefully from one end until you have it all the way in. Then withdraw it and reassemble, putting the lever arms in place one at a time, having previously tested them to ensure that all the lever arms are free to rotate on the axle (but not loosely and floppily!). Graphite powder or a light rubbing of candle wax on the axle can help here, but don't be tempted to use any other form of lubrication.
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Winston Smith

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Re: Button lever hinge?
« Reply #11 on: March 24, 2016, 02:27:13 PM »

OK. I'll see if I can have another go at it in a while. But for now, I feel like having a little play on my flashy Hohner.
Thanks again.
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Re: Button lever hinge?
« Reply #12 on: March 24, 2016, 11:13:08 PM »

Well, I managed to ream out 7 levers before I had to stop to go to choir practice. I made the reamer from a bit of the same welding rod; filed half of it away so that I had a sharp edge and then filed a twist drill sort of point on it. It works reasonably well, but being unused to finnicky work I put too much pressure on it and it twisted somewhat. Not enough so that it wouldn't come fairly straight, though, I'm glad to say.
Now I've got the 7 levers on the piece of rod which will eventually become the axle; they're quite free, but I'll give them a bit more working with the old ground-down pencil lead before I'm really happy with them. With a bit of luck I'll get the others done on the morning. Then it will be the dreaded slot!
Dare I ask if anyone out there might have a spare metal cap, for one of the treble buttons? I've a button missing altogether, which is not an insurmountable problem in itself, but the metal cap is. It measures 9.9 mm, outside. (So probably 10, and corroded!)
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triskel

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Re: Button lever hinge?
« Reply #13 on: March 25, 2016, 12:44:30 AM »

... the metal cap ... measures 9.9 mm, outside. (So probably 10, and corroded!)

More likely it's a "nominal" 10mm...  ???

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Re: Button lever hinge?
« Reply #14 on: March 25, 2016, 02:41:39 PM »

Thankfully, making a reamer for the slot and actually reaming it out was nowhere near as dicey as I had feared. My little half-inch half-round file worked a treat! I filed the first few centimetres down to easily slide through the bottom of the slot and act as a guide to keep the cutting section straight. I then filed a spiral cutting edge into it, and Bob was my uncle. I only had to keep a touch of pressure on the reamer (that's what the screwdriver is doing in the pic) to make sure that it stayed in the bottom of the slot. I'm really rather pleased with myself.
The end is now screwed onto the bellows and it makes noise, even without any gasket, as I did away with the green electrician's tape which the former owner had been using. (?????) If only I'd taken some bellows gasket off Theo, when I saw him yesterday, I could have been playing the thing by now. I suppose that I'll have to make do with the Hohner, again!
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Psuggmog Volbenz

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Re: Button lever hinge?
« Reply #15 on: March 27, 2016, 04:18:01 AM »

Sorry to chime in so late in this thread, on the road on an extended trip. I would have suggested pluging the worn holes and redrilling to original size, similar to rebushing a worn pegbox on a violin.  Bicycle spokes come in several diameters and metal compositions. Stainless steel and various steel alloys as well as straight guage and single and double butted varieties. The straight guage would be the only suitable type for this application. An easy way to enlarge the axle slot would be to temporarily fill the slot leaving a small void at the bottom and drill to the desired diameter. Next remove the filler piece and replace withthe original filler piece. Bicycle spokes make great drills for use in wood. Slightly flatten the end and file to a centered point. Common muliti-purpose twist drills have a 59 degree angle at the tip. I have even drilled longitudinally curved holes using shopmade bicycle spoke drills.
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Re: Button lever hinge?
« Reply #16 on: March 27, 2016, 10:51:09 AM »

Psuggmog, your offerings are always worth waiting for. Our constant mantra in Egypt is "Better late than never", but that's not because of any reason other than it's just, "Egypt time"!
Although your method might seem simple enough to you, believe me that it sounds anything but, to a dummy like me. The way I ended up accomplishing it was surprisingly simple, and proved to be relatively easy. As I said, I'm super pleased with the result.
However, when I came to put it all back together, I found that the joints on the wooden bellows-end were all loose and had to be glued and clamped up, and then (joy of joys!) that the screw holes in the treble bellows-end were stripped. Also, they aren't the original holes, so I might just drill the long sides and fasten it together there. We'll see.
I hope that your "extended trip" went well, and that you enjoyed it.
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