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Author Topic: Which F#?  (Read 1232 times)

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t-tone

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Which F#?
« on: September 26, 2016, 08:39:54 PM »

I seem to be coming across a lot of tunes in G that make full use of the low D E and F# and I've been struggling to get the finger-work smooth, trying to be careful not to use the same finger for consecutive notes on different buttons. A couple of tunes have been made very much easier by using the push F# on the D-row, rather than the 'normal' pull F# on the G-row. However this introduces a choice of F#, which might change through the tune, and as everyone will know also complicates the bass end, trying to swap from G/D to D/A as and when necessary, without throwing in an unwanted A. Note, I generally play the low D on the D-row.

I was wondering if there is a systematic way to approach this, or is it something that will have to eventually just come together after a prolonged struggle? How did others get over this idiosyncrasy?

Thanks in advance,
Tony
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Practice, even when success looks hopeless. The left hand, inept in other respects for lack of practice, can grasp the reins more firmly than the right, because here it has had practice (M. Aurelius)

JohnAndy

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Re: Which F#?
« Reply #1 on: September 26, 2016, 09:55:28 PM »

My general approach would be to use whichever F# works better for the right hand. Assuming I want a D bass/chord under this, I would then use G/D or D/A buttons in the bass, whichever is needed to get the D bass/chord. This adjustment in the bass gets more automatic after a while, though it's still something I'm working on. I guess it helps that I'm using 4 fingers on the bass side, so I always have a finger poised over each of the 4 relevant bass/chord buttons ready to go with no hand movement required.

It will be interesting to see what other people think...
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Anahata

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Re: Which F#?
« Reply #2 on: September 26, 2016, 10:08:20 PM »

Treat it, not as an idiosyncracy you have to "get over", but a welcome opportunity to use alternate fingerings which will help get you out of knots with the RH fingering, or help you with bellows management, or with musical phrasing, or with playing E minor chords instead of G sometimes.

Yes, of course its confusing when there are two ways of doing something, but it will come together after a while.
Don't obsess over finding the most efficient way though. Sometimes it's not worth it; you might as well hop from one note to the next on the same finger, when the alternative is to try to make your fingers do something unintuitive and complicated which they can't get right anyway.
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Thrupenny Bit

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Re: Which F#?
« Reply #3 on: September 27, 2016, 08:22:33 AM »

A good point Anahata.
When first tackling a new tune I try to be logical ( or efficient ) and cross row to have fluid runs, often working hard to practice that particular finger movement.
When I've got to grips with the tune and it starts to flow without thinking too much I sometimes find my logically thought out finger patterns go out the window and the fingers take over and play something their way.
Never thought about that before but on reflection I have noticed it happening!
Q
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I think I'm starting to get most of the notes in roughly the right order...... sometimes!

Chris Ryall

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Re: Which F#?
« Reply #4 on: September 27, 2016, 03:31:01 PM »

Either may be right.  I see it is terms of musical tension v relaxation.  As a guide I find it helpful to be aware that F# is arguably the most relaxed note against push G - it is the scale's major 7 and the jazzer's 'cool' ending. It is also  'coolish' against B ... (3rd harmonic)

Pull F# will be played against an A (acting as minor in G) C D, or E  note or bass?

A: it is the  natural 6 of the A scale - very coloured musically ( the dorian note)
D : is is he major 3rd, again a very coloured interval
C: F# is a sharp 4th in the scale - the 'devil's interval and so most discordant note against the scale
Em: F# is a 9th agaist that chord, can be a cool or tense not depeding on how you get to it ;)

If you don't beleive this just hold a C bass and wander push/pull up ther G row scale. note how  the F# "rings out"

So if you want your F# to be a passing or unnoticed note in the tune a push one will achieve that (and it just 'want's' to resolve to G)?   

If for musical reasons you want it to be moment of tension in the melody the pull one will commonly achieve that. And you can (legally) choose any of 4 chords >:E
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t-tone

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Re: Which F#?
« Reply #5 on: September 27, 2016, 07:52:48 PM »

Thanks for the thoughtful replies, guys. Plenty to chew on there.
Tony
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Practice, even when success looks hopeless. The left hand, inept in other respects for lack of practice, can grasp the reins more firmly than the right, because here it has had practice (M. Aurelius)
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