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Author Topic: DG layout that is basically the same in both octaves  (Read 7229 times)

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george garside

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Re: DG layout that is basically the same in both octaves
« Reply #40 on: January 05, 2017, 03:50:24 PM »

the push/pull sequence is exactly the same in both octaves --push/pull, push/pull. push/pull  pull/push or blow/suk. blow/suck,  blow/suck, suck/blow if you prefer. The difference between playing in the two octaves is simply that the button sequence is different I,e instead of blowing and sucking on the same button   you blow on one and suck on the next one higher (towards the feet)

the easiest way of getting the hang of it is to practice playing both octaves until you can play them smoothly and without a pause in the middle!

george
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RPr

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Re: DG layout that is basically the same in both octaves
« Reply #41 on: January 07, 2017, 03:32:09 AM »

Les,

As a beginner I like the idea, it just makes sense. Veteran players might have a hard time adjusting and there may be some advantages for specific music styles.

Still as an old timey banjo player, I often use different tunings for different musical keys or songs. Different tunings require different fingerings.     

Definitely and interesting idea. Probably will not catch on. But there are Anglo and English concertinas so who knows. 
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Howard Jones

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Re: DG layout that is basically the same in both octaves
« Reply #42 on: January 13, 2017, 06:36:04 PM »

As a beginner I like the idea, it just makes sense.

With respect, may I gently suggest that it may appear to make sense because you are a beginner. It appears to remove the complication of having to learn a different button sequence for both octaves.  However what it does instead is to break up the logic of the scale and add a greater complication by adding an unnecessary break in the fingering pattern when you play across the 'join; between the two octaves.

The keyboard is not set in stone, and had it been designed differently from the outset we would have got used to something different.  It is not that difficult to get used to different layouts - all my melodeons and concertinas differ slightly, and like you I am used to different tunings on stringed instruments. However the established layout has a clear logic which allows the playing to flow easily, and which is obvious and straightforward if you think of it as a whole run of notes rather than two separate octaves placed next to each other.  As a general rule, the more logical an instrument is the easier it is to play, and I think it is more logical to maintain a continuous fingering pattern up and down the scale than it is to introduce something different halfway along.



Andrew Wigglesworth

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Re: DG layout that is basically the same in both octaves
« Reply #43 on: January 14, 2017, 07:57:13 PM »

Sorry, another one here who thinks this doesn't make sense.

It would mean extra buttons on the box, greater stretches in tunes and mess with playing octaves all for solving a problem that doesn't really exist. As George points out, the present layout is actually logical in itself, keeping with the push-pull pattern of notes (if not buttons) and it really is trivial to learn (in the general scheme of learning to play a melodeon).

Moving into the second octave is so common in tunes that I think the downsides of doing this mod would far outweigh any percieved advantages.

RPr

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Re: DG layout that is basically the same in both octaves
« Reply #44 on: January 15, 2017, 03:44:21 AM »

The guitar, violin and other instruments that have withstood the test of time, because their figuring serves the majority well. Hence it is not likely to change.

Still one does find instrument tuning that are unique to specific music and players. Perhaps the best example is to try and play Cajun music on a standard chromatic accordion keyboard. The notes are all there, but the Cajun sound is not.

Given the number of button boxes around the various world cultures, I would venture a guess that there are indeed other standard tunings unique to other music styles.   

Again this is simply a fun mind exercise and perhaps a few experimental souls will test it out. I do not see a Melodeon revolution in the future.

Happy tune
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Dazbo

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Re: DG layout that is basically the same in both octaves
« Reply #45 on: January 18, 2017, 05:01:58 PM »

Doesn't make any practical sense to me either.  There's plenty of instruments where the fingering changes in different octaves and people cope easily.  If it was a real problem and there was a better solution we would have had it decades ago.

Bite the bullet and noodle around in the upper octave - as has already been mentioned some tunes are easier to play up there - and our continental cousins start in the upper octave and worry about delving into the lower octave :D
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Daddy Long Les

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Re: DG layout that is basically the same in both octaves
« Reply #46 on: January 18, 2017, 05:59:11 PM »

Doesn't make any practical sense to me either.  There's plenty of instruments where the fingering changes in different octaves and people cope easily.  If it was a real problem and there was a better solution we would have had it decades ago.

Bite the bullet and noodle around in the upper octave - as has already been mentioned some tunes are easier to play up there - and our continental cousins start in the upper octave and worry about delving into the lower octave :D

I already play extensively in the upper octave and I'm quite happy to do so.  My original post was just an enquiry as to whether there had ever been a layout like this.  The answers have been interesting.  I wasn't proposing that we throw out the current layout - that wouldn't be make any sense at all.  I'm really not trying to reinvent the wheel.  Let's leave it at that shall we?
« Last Edit: January 19, 2017, 07:23:29 AM by Daddy Long Les »
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Andrew Wigglesworth

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Re: DG layout that is basically the same in both octaves
« Reply #47 on: January 22, 2017, 10:59:57 PM »

Doesn't make any practical sense to me either.  There's plenty of instruments where the fingering changes in different octaves and people cope easily.  If it was a real problem and there was a better solution we would have had it decades ago.

Bite the bullet and noodle around in the upper octave - as has already been mentioned some tunes are easier to play up there - and our continental cousins start in the upper octave and worry about delving into the lower octave :D

I already play extensively in the upper octave and I'm quite happy to do so.  My original post was just an enquiry as to whether there had ever been a layout like this.  The answers have been interesting.  I wasn't proposing that we throw out the current layout - that wouldn't be make any sense at all.  I'm really not trying to reinvent the wheel.  Let's leave it at that shall we?

I hope you didn't think any of the responses were personally hostile  :-\

The suggestion made me think for a short while about it, and the answer was in good faith; the sort of thing that might come up in conversation at a festival session or workshop.
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