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Author Topic: How to produce sheet music, or ABC notation for music learned by ear  (Read 586 times)

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Maggie

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My apologies if this is a stupid question. 

I am learning to play my diato here in France and my teacher records new tunes for me to learn by ear.  I would like to post recordings of some of them, now that I am gaining a bit of confidence and I would like to include either sheet music on pdf or abc.

Is there an easy way to do this - the thought of having to transcribe by hand is a bit daunting?

Thanks   :|||:
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Thrupenny Bit

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Re: How to produce sheet music, or ABC notation for music learned by ear
« Reply #1 on: March 11, 2017, 01:33:44 PM »

If you create an abc file of a tune, it can generate a PDFs file from it.
But you do have to put the tune into an abc format first....

Two abc editors are abcexplorer and easy abc for a PC, or Tunebook for my iPad ( and Mac? ).
There Is information about abc in the articles bit on the left hand of the forums Home page.
Cheers
Q
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Thrupenny Bit

I think I'm starting to get most of the notes in roughly the right order...... sometimes!

Howard Mitchell-Borts (Mitch)

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Re: How to produce sheet music, or ABC notation for music learned by ear
« Reply #2 on: March 11, 2017, 01:41:56 PM »

Do you mean automatically transcribe the audio to notation?
There are ways of doing this such as http://www.intelliscore.net but it's expensive and I'm not convinced about the reliability.

Perhaps better to slow the recording down ( I use transcribe from http://www.seventhstring.co.uk but there's also https://www.ronimusic.com/amsldowin.htm) and then use the notation program your choice.

Mitch
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Thrupenny Bit

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Re: How to produce sheet music, or ABC notation for music learned by ear
« Reply #3 on: March 11, 2017, 02:40:05 PM »

That transcribe prog. looks interesting.
I've never needed to transcribe from a recording, but that looks like it makes it easier.

I used Amazing slowdowner on my iPad, which looks to be the Apple iOS equivalent of yours for PC.
It is excellent. It works by importing a tune, mine are generally from my iTunes.
I have learnt how to record the video sound from YouTube on my PC. If there's a tune played I like I can record it using Audacity, which can convert it to an MP3 file, import it into iTunes, sync the iPad and off I go with Amazing slowdowner....
It all links together and my iPad and me can go somewhere quiet to learn the tune.
Q
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Thrupenny Bit

I think I'm starting to get most of the notes in roughly the right order...... sometimes!

The Blues Viking

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Re: How to produce sheet music, or ABC notation for music learned by ear
« Reply #4 on: March 12, 2017, 12:36:13 AM »

Two abc editors are abcexplorer and easy abc for a PC, or Tunebook for my iPad ( and Mac? ).
There Is information about abc in the articles bit on the left hand of the forums Home page.
Cheers
Q

EasyABC is available for the Mac (it's what I currently use). I think Tunebook only runs on the Ipad.

TBV
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Thrupenny Bit

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Re: How to produce sheet music, or ABC notation for music learned by ear
« Reply #5 on: March 12, 2017, 08:52:25 AM »

Ah right, that's cleared that up.
Thanks TBV.
Q
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Thrupenny Bit

I think I'm starting to get most of the notes in roughly the right order...... sometimes!

Tone Dumb Greg

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Re: How to produce sheet music, or ABC notation for music learned by ear
« Reply #6 on: March 12, 2017, 09:35:58 AM »

My apologies if this is a stupid question. 

I am learning to play my diato here in France and my teacher records new tunes for me to learn by ear.  I would like to post recordings of some of them, now that I am gaining a bit of confidence and I would like to include either sheet music on pdf or abc.

Is there an easy way to do this - the thought of having to transcribe by hand is a bit daunting?

Thanks   :|||:
Hello Maggie, that's not at all a stupid question. Quite the opposite.
You say your teacher has got you learning by ear. That's fine but do you already have any familiarity with musical notation? If you don't, you face a bit of a learning curve. If you already have an understanding, even a basic one, of conventional music scoring, you life will be a lot easier.

If you don't I would suggest that devote your time at the moment to learning to play (:) The rest can come later.
If I want the score for a tune I am lucky enough that the tunes I play are often already available either as ABC files, jpgs etc. and a search often locates them. Alternatively, your teacher may be able to point you at sources, even if they don't use them personally.

Iff you do, stick around here and someone will will give you some good info on how to learn to use ABC (I would start here http://forum.melodeon.net/index.php/page,abc.html. )
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playandteach

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Re: How to produce sheet music, or ABC notation for music learned by ear
« Reply #7 on: March 12, 2017, 11:56:44 AM »

Are you suggesting writing out tunes that you play for the use of others? If so, then perhaps it is easier to source them from somewhere else and just provide a link. If it's for your own memory jogger, then any system that works for you is good enough - someone, I think Jack Humphries, has a system where he puts the first few notes down in a table of tunes.
If you are asking about using notation - then there are lots of systems, and Musescore seems to be a well recognised and free option. I've tried it briefly myself without a problem.
If you are asking about software to translate audio into scores, then it's not refined enough yet, and you need good notation skills to correct it.
If you are asking about learning the theory of music notation, then that is a long term project.
Could you clarify which of these is your main objective?
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Maggie

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Re: How to produce sheet music, or ABC notation for music learned by ear
« Reply #8 on: March 16, 2017, 09:11:09 PM »

Thank you all very much for your answers.  My musical theory skills are limited, as are my computer skills.  I will take the advice offered and continue to learn my tunes by ear.   It seems the process of producing musical notation is too difficult for me, so will shelve that idea.

Some of the tunes that I am learning are lovely.  I will have a go at recording and posting one or two - and maybe will be able to find some sheet music.  A friend has just lent me a copy of "Recueil de morceaux Auvergnats traditionnels"  which is tunes collected by Pierre Ladonne, plus pieces composed by Pierre and Pascal Ladonne.  I recognise a few of the titles, so could start there.

Thanks again for the help  :|||:
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Lyra

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Re: How to produce sheet music, or ABC notation for music learned by ear
« Reply #9 on: March 16, 2017, 11:13:00 PM »


I have scorecloud express on my ipad. It is aching accurate, noting every stutter, hesitation and slight "not quite on the beatness" in shaming detail.

However this is melnet - any posting of a cool tune with a "has anyone got the dots/abc" usually results in someone posting before you can say "Robert est le frère de ton père". Harness the hive mind  :|||:
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Stiamh

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Re: How to produce sheet music, or ABC notation for music learned by ear
« Reply #10 on: March 17, 2017, 12:47:58 AM »

Just a thought, Maggie - and without wishing to be condescending - when you learn a piece by ear, do you know the names of the notes you are playing?

If you do, especially the English names rather than the French ones, you are almost halfway to being able to write tunes in ABC format - and tunes in ABC format can very easily be converted into conventional staff notation.

Once you know the names of notes, most of what is missing is note lengths and bar lines, and with a bit of help from people here (which many would be happy to provide, I'm sure) you could crack that part of it easily.

JM

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Re: How to produce sheet music, or ABC notation for music learned by ear
« Reply #11 on: March 17, 2017, 01:02:17 AM »

Additionally, so many tunes are already have sheet music or abc's online.   
So if you know the tune's name, it may exist online in ready-to-use form!

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lachenal74693

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Re: How to produce sheet music, or ABC notation for music learned by ear
« Reply #12 on: March 17, 2017, 05:17:42 AM »

Just a thought, Maggie - and without wishing to be condescending - when you learn a piece by ear, do you know the names of the notes you are playing?

If you do, especially the English names rather than the French ones, you are almost halfway to being able to write tunes in ABC format - and tunes in ABC format can very easily be converted into conventional staff notation.

Once you know the names of notes, most of what is missing is note lengths and bar lines, and with a bit of help from people here (which many would be happy to provide, I'm sure) you could crack that part of it easily.

It may be worth mentioning that there is an (experimental) do-re-mi mode in EasyABC
which allows the typing in of tunes using do2, re/2, mi, etc. rather than C2, D/2, E, etc.

I've only tested it briefly myself but it seems to work. Note that in the generated ABC
script, any do2, re/2, mi, etc. typed in is rendered as C2, D/2, E, etc.

R
« Last Edit: March 17, 2017, 05:29:20 AM by lachenal74693 »
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Maggie

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Re: How to produce sheet music, or ABC notation for music learned by ear
« Reply #13 on: March 19, 2017, 06:11:29 AM »

Just a thought, Maggie - and without wishing to be condescending - when you learn a piece by ear, do you know the names of the notes you are playing?

When I was younger (much) and lived in Scotland, I sang and played the guitar to accompany myself.  I read music slowly, but well enough in those days to learn new songs.  On the diato, I know most of the C row notes, but not so good on the G Row.  I will look into scorecloud express, and meanwhile post tunes where I can find some sheet music - often in a different key and maybe with slight variations, but that's folk music!
Thanks again  :|||:
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Saltarelle l'elfique 19+2 in G/C

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malcolmbebb

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Re: How to produce sheet music, or ABC notation for music learned by ear
« Reply #14 on: March 19, 2017, 09:18:26 AM »


I have scorecloud express on my ipad. It is aching accurate, noting every stutter, hesitation and slight "not quite on the beatness" in shaming detail.

However this is melnet - any posting of a cool tune with a "has anyone got the dots/abc" usually results in someone posting before you can say "Robert est le frère de ton père". Harness the hive mind  :|||:

I looked at this but the reviews were scathing. I guess your experience is much better?
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Lyra

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Re: How to produce sheet music, or ABC notation for music learned by ear
« Reply #15 on: March 19, 2017, 09:29:37 AM »

I looked at this but the reviews were scathing. I guess your experience is much better?

Well, it works OK for whistle tunes providing you can be bothered to edit it into what you meant rather than what you actually played. I imagine playing a box into it would produce, um, interesting results more akin to artwork than actual notation.

I now need to nip off and try it  :-\
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JD

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Re: How to produce sheet music, or ABC notation for music learned by ear
« Reply #16 on: March 19, 2017, 12:15:48 PM »

If you have the name of the tune you might try looking at http://diato.org/tablat.htm. This is a page on Bernard Loffet's site that has a large number of French tunes in midi, abc and png formats. You can see the music (and melodeon tab) and the ABC and listen to a rather tinkly midi rendition all at once.
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Rob2Hook

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Re: How to produce sheet music, or ABC notation for music learned by ear
« Reply #17 on: March 19, 2017, 05:51:10 PM »

I know this may seem condescending, but have you asked your tutor if they can copy the manuscripts?

Rob (who takes an age to read a tune)
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Maggie

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Re: How to produce sheet music, or ABC notation for music learned by ear
« Reply #18 on: March 19, 2017, 08:54:13 PM »

Not at all condescending Rob.  My teacher also learned the tunes by ear, so doesn't often use sheet music.  In fact, I understand that she only really honed her music reading skills when studying for the teaching diploma.  Very much an oral tradition here, which is why many tunes have slight variations depending on the region, or even department (county).

I do know of many French sites that give music scores, but - again due to the local nature of many tunes - Creuse, Correze and even the Auvergne music is not often listed.  Cabrette and cornemuse books are a good source of information.  I am enjoying the research; this summer at Le Son Continu festival, I shall be looking for old pipe music books.   :|||:
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Maggie

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Re: How to produce sheet music, or ABC notation for music learned by ear
« Reply #19 on: March 20, 2017, 05:50:47 AM »

Very much an oral tradition

My apologies - an aural tradition!  Too tired after a day in the garden to think straight  :|||:
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