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Author Topic: 2 1/2 row Sandpiper, Pastourelle 2 or other?  (Read 1031 times)

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Nick Ray

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2 1/2 row Sandpiper, Pastourelle 2 or other?
« on: March 18, 2017, 03:53:37 PM »

Having been on Squeezy's 2.5 row introduction workshop at Witney I'm interested in hearing any opinions regarding 2.5 row D/G boxes. I'm in the market for something up to £2000. I've contacted Sandpiper and they had a couple of 'Stowe' available. I also see that a new Pastourelle 2 is sold by Eagle Music for £2100. Or perhaps someone is thinking of selling?
Theo has a Pariselle for sale but not sure about buying something that was built to suit the person who built it. Maybe I'm being too cautious... 
Are Saltarelle sold by anyone down the southern end of the country that I might be able to visit and try out?

All views and experiences gratefully received thanks.


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Ray

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Re: 2 1/2 row Sandpiper, Pastourelle 2 or other?
« Reply #1 on: March 18, 2017, 05:38:04 PM »

One of your other options is to get Mike Rowbotham to set you up a 2.4 row Erika or something similar. I had him wack a third voice and more basses in to mine (which I can only imagine was achieved using some form of wizardry) for within your price range. Honestly the best box I've ever owned. Make sure you try any Saltarelles before you buy them, I've found that some are amazing and some aren't.

One word of warning before you head into 2.5 row territory, make sure you're ready to never be quite satisfied with your layout. It's an Endless pursuit really, but I think its well worth all the befuddlement.
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Theo

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Re: 2 1/2 row Sandpiper, Pastourelle 2 or other?
« Reply #2 on: March 18, 2017, 07:06:29 PM »

I will have a DG Erika fir sale in a few weeks.  A 12 bass version.  I've also an older Castagnari Dony 8 DG.
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Theo Gibb

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jikeym

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Re: 2 1/2 row Sandpiper, Pastourelle 2 or other?
« Reply #3 on: March 20, 2017, 07:50:06 PM »

Avoid Sandpiper like the plague....I bought one and it was horrific. I sent it back thinking I'd got the pig in a poke but the replacement was just as bad. My advice is to spend a few more hundred quid and get something decent.
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Steve_freereeder

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Re: 2 1/2 row Sandpiper, Pastourelle 2 or other?
« Reply #4 on: March 21, 2017, 01:40:50 AM »

Having been on Squeezy's 2.5 row introduction workshop at Witney I'm interested in hearing any opinions regarding 2.5 row D/G boxes. I'm in the market for something up to £2000.
....
All views and experiences gratefully received thanks.

PM sent.
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Steve
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Nick Ray

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Re: 2 1/2 row Sandpiper, Pastourelle 2 or other?
« Reply #5 on: March 23, 2017, 04:58:37 PM »

Avoid Sandpiper like the plague....I bought one and it was horrific. I sent it back thinking I'd got the pig in a poke but the replacement was just as bad. My advice is to spend a few more hundred quid and get something decent.

Thanks jikeym, always good to get a clear opinion! (:)
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Nick Ray

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Re: 2 1/2 row Sandpiper, Pastourelle 2 or other?
« Reply #6 on: March 23, 2017, 05:00:05 PM »

Thanks everyone.
Now time to ponder..... :|glug
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rileycat

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Re: 2 1/2 row Sandpiper, Pastourelle 2 or other?
« Reply #7 on: March 23, 2017, 05:37:05 PM »

I'll also give a shout-out for how good a well set-up Hohner Erika is, especially if it comes with 12 basses. They're quite light-weight, responsive, and have good volume.  I'll double-up the Saltarelle 'try-before-you-buy advice, too.  You probably already know (but just in case you don't  ;), that the half rows are not necessarily set in a standard sequence - there can be reversals and octave differences between the same buttons on different instruments on the half-row.  It's nothing a tuner can't sort out to your need, but a nuisance to re-learn or an extra delay/expense to have fettled, so get a note chart for the instrument you are thinking of buying...... or play it, of course!  Can I also add that I found the Pastourelles with 12 basses, belonging to 2 friends, are both pretty heavy on the left arm, especially compared to a Hohner Erika.
« Last Edit: March 23, 2017, 05:40:24 PM by rileycat »
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benammiswift

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Re: 2 1/2 row Sandpiper, Pastourelle 2 or other?
« Reply #8 on: March 23, 2017, 05:56:37 PM »

Gonna throw my hat in the ring haha. Nicely set up ericas or the older hohner clubs from Mike are really really nice so a definite option if I were you. I agree with the advice given about Saltarelle, they can be a very mixed bag in my experience. Having tried numerous Sandpipers including the 2.5 row prototype I can't honestly echo what has been said above, to me they are nice responsive little melodeons that are well built and amazing for the money.

Shop around for what people like Theo have, the 2.5 Dony looks nice if you don't mind 8 basses but there's a chance it could be modded to have 12 like is standard nowadays. Not sure on that, not my area really.

Maybe drop an ad in Buy/Sell and see what crops up.

I honestly wouldn't be bothered by brand, If you like it can afford it. Buy It!!!!

That's just my thoughts, Hope you find what you like. I agree with the not quite being happy, I get that even with my D/G/Accidentals with a full row so just something to bear in mind

Hope this helps

Benammi
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GPS

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Re: 2 1/2 row Sandpiper, Pastourelle 2 or other?
« Reply #9 on: March 23, 2017, 06:36:07 PM »

FWIW, I concur with what seems to be the general opinion on Saltarelles. I've had my Pastourelle 2 for 30 years or so and I love it; it's never let me down and remains a delight to play.  On the other hand I've played a Connemara 2 about 15 years newer, ostensibly a very similar if not identical box, and it was absolutely dreadful. I don't know whether it's down to age, provenance (Saltarelles are, as we know, actually manufactured by various Italian factories) or plain quality control - ie luck of the draw.  I have a 3-row Saltarelle in my workshop for some tuning and "drying out" - it is currently tuned VERY wet and belongs to an Irish box-player friend - which I haven't tried yet, so it will be interesting to see how that compares.

Graham
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Among others, Saltarelle Pastourelle II D/G; Hohner 4-stop 1-rows in C & G; assorted Hohners; 3-voice German (?) G/C of uncertain parentage; lovely little Hlavacek 1-row Heligonka; B♭/E♭ Koch undergoing a rebuild. Also Fender Jazz bass, Telecaster, Stratocaster, Epiphone Sheraton, Charvel-Jackson 000-style acoustic guitar and other stuff..........

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Re: 2 1/2 row Sandpiper, Pastourelle 2 or other?
« Reply #10 on: March 24, 2017, 12:32:43 AM »

Having tried numerous Sandpipers including the 2.5 row prototype I can't honestly echo what has been said above, to me they are nice responsive little melodeons that are well built and amazing for the money.

For me the 2.5 row prototype Sandpiper was the only one I've ever played which was anything like decent. All the others I've ever tried were, well, let's just say disappointing; I would have expected better. Perhaps more care and attention is needed in their set-up before being released on to the market. Specific downsides I've noticed have been indifferent tuning - particularly inconsistent tremolo; and too much audible reed tongue 'twang' after the button has been released and not just on the lowest pitched reeds. Maybe better quality valves would help here.
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squeezy

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Re: 2 1/2 row Sandpiper, Pastourelle 2 or other?
« Reply #11 on: March 24, 2017, 12:45:58 AM »

I agree that any instrument sold must be up to the job, but I do think that sometimes the Sandpipers suffer from the fact that they have expensive Italian-type styling and people expect them to play the same too ... you should never lose sight of the fact that they are significantly cheaper than a new Italian box.  You get what you pay for.
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benammiswift

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Re: 2 1/2 row Sandpiper, Pastourelle 2 or other?
« Reply #12 on: March 28, 2017, 08:15:38 AM »

Just as a follow up. I was lent a C#/D sandpiper to dep in a band last weekend at it was great. A brilliant box for the money.

Just thought I'd give you that recent experience as it is a while since i played a sandpiper.

Go with what you like regardless of manufacturer.

Benammi
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MandoC

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Re: 2 1/2 row Sandpiper, Pastourelle 2 or other?
« Reply #13 on: March 28, 2017, 04:45:46 PM »

Nick:  Here is another vote for a Mike Rowbotham rehabbed Erica.  He made a BC enhanced swing tuned box with a John Williams 12 bass system for me. There was no 2.5 row. The setup action is excellent.  Not a hint of buttons clacking. It is fun to play.  I have yet to take to the bass system, but that was my choice. I feel like I have a classic antique that plays like a new box. He told me that I could have the bass system changed by having him make a new setup and sending it to me. The only thing I wish I had done was having him put a thumb groove on the treble keybosrd. I'm pretty sure he could do that if you asked him.  My two cents   Charlie
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Re: 2 1/2 row Sandpiper, Pastourelle 2 or other?
« Reply #14 on: March 28, 2017, 06:04:30 PM »

I have a CF Sandpiper. I like it a lot. It has very dry, almost completely dry, tuning which is an interesting contrast with my other boxes which have varying degrees of swing tuning. What I do notice is that the bellows action is a bit "stiff" - I suspect this is due to the reeds not speaking as quickly as they might. It sounds like a bad thing, but in practice it lends itself to a certain style of playing which I quite like. A good example is the playing of Luke Dix:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dsYLWiXcSgE
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Nick Ray

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Re: 2 1/2 row Sandpiper, Pastourelle 2 or other?
« Reply #15 on: March 29, 2017, 01:01:41 PM »

Clearly the important thing is to try before I buy (where possible..).
As I can afford it I think I'll concentrate on seeking out a good s/h Saltarelle or Pariselle for now (following the 'get what you pay for' principal).
Thanks everyone for your comments.
Much appreciated as ever.

Nick
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