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Author Topic: Bertrand Galliard Accordion Shipping Process  (Read 3432 times)

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odonovanchris

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Bertrand Galliard Accordion Shipping Process
« on: April 10, 2017, 10:07:37 PM »

Hello All,

I have been waiting patiently for the Gaillard Cristal 12 bass B/C model I ordered from Bertrand himself 3 years ago. I'm glad to say I've only got another 3 months until I get my hands on the finished machine.

Now another dilemma has presented itself. I live in Canada and the price Bertrand quoted me was the tax-free price since it's being shipped outside Europe. If I pick it up in-person from him would he have to charge me the tax? Or if he shipped it would I pay tax on the other side? I'm obviously nervous about having it shipped due to the risk of damage etc.

Has anyone else been in this situation? Any recommendations on the best way to sort this out? Anyone know what Mr. Gaillard is like to deal with during the final delivery process? I'd love to go visit him at his workshop to pick it up since I waited so long (and patiently) for this moment.

Thanks and I appreciate any help!
Chris
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John MacKenzie (Cugiok)

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Re: Bertrand Galliard Accordion Shipping Process
« Reply #1 on: April 10, 2017, 10:15:01 PM »

As far as I am aware, if it comes into the country with you as part of your baggage, you don't pay duty. I carried one guitar back from the US, and had no problems, while the one I had shipped via DHL was charged at £400 import duty.
You really need to get in contact with someone your side of the water who has done this.


Sir John
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odonovanchris

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Re: Bertrand Galliard Accordion Shipping Process
« Reply #2 on: April 10, 2017, 10:18:03 PM »

Thanks John,

Apparently there's a tax refund kiosk in Airports once you present the receipt. But I'm not fully sure what the process is. Hopefully someone else that knows could chime in.

Cheers!

As far as I am aware, if it comes into the country with you as part of your baggage, you don't pay duty. I carried one guitar back from the US, and had no problems, while the one I had shipped via DHL was charged at £400 import duty.
You really need to get in contact with someone your side of the water who has done this.


Sir John
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tirpous

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Re: Bertrand Galliard Accordion Shipping Process
« Reply #3 on: April 10, 2017, 10:45:56 PM »

If you have it shipped, check this site for duties/taxes: http://www.cbsa-asfc.gc.ca/import/postal-postale/menu-eng.html

If you go get it: http://www.cbsa-asfc.gc.ca/travel-voyage/bgb-rmf-eng.html

I hope this helps.
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JohnAndy

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Re: Bertrand Galliard Accordion Shipping Process
« Reply #4 on: April 10, 2017, 11:24:07 PM »

As far as I am aware, if it comes into the country with you as part of your baggage, you don't pay duty. I carried one guitar back from the US, and had no problems

I don't think this is correct at all! (assuming you're talking in this case about importing the guitar from the US to the UK)

When you import an item over the (quite small) allowances limit, you're liable for duty, whether you ship it or carry it yourself as part of your luggage.

If you declared the guitar when you went through UK Customs and they decided not to bother charging you import duty, then that's fair enough.

But if you just walked through the green "nothing to declare" channel then that counts as smuggling - if they'd happened to check your luggage then you could potentially have had the guitar confiscated and have received some fines on top of that.

I would expect similar to apply for imports into Canada.
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Stiamh

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Re: Bertrand Galliard Accordion Shipping Process
« Reply #5 on: April 11, 2017, 01:19:15 AM »

Thanks John, Apparently there's a tax refund kiosk in Airports once you present the receipt. But I'm not fully sure what the process is. Hopefully someone else that knows could chime in.

You claim the sales tax refund at the airport as you are leaving France. Coming into Canada you will be liable for GST definitely and excise duty possibly. It is advisable to pay all that stuff and keep the receipts so that any time you leave the country with the box, when you come back you have documents to prove that you have already paid everything you should have paid to bring it into Canada.

The border agents will want to see an invoice, and if you don't show them one, they will search the web to find out the value of the instrument!

I know this from experience. A few years ago I bought a box second-hand in the US and declared it on my way back into Canada. I didn't have an invoice and the agent promptly searched the web and told me the price for a new one (more than double what I had actually paid). To convince him not to charge me GST on that amount I had to log into my PayPal account on his computer and show him the transaction! So don't mess with these people....

Dazbo

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Re: Bertrand Galliard Accordion Shipping Process
« Reply #6 on: April 11, 2017, 01:06:14 PM »

Now, if you were to take an old battered box case with an old battered melodeon in it and bring back the new melodeon in the old case....

 >:E

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Henry Piper

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Re: Bertrand Galliard Accordion Shipping Process
« Reply #7 on: April 11, 2017, 04:33:51 PM »

Now, if you were to take an old battered box case with an old battered melodeon in it and bring back the new melodeon in the old case....

 >:E
.................It would still be counted as smuggling if you didn't declare it as new I,m afraid !! >:E >:E
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Steve C.

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Re: Bertrand Galliard Accordion Shipping Process
« Reply #8 on: April 11, 2017, 05:08:57 PM »

I "know" a lot of you guys are kidding, but, believe me, at least here in the States, the Customs people seldom have a good sense of humor.
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Roger Howard

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Re: Bertrand Galliard Accordion Shipping Process
« Reply #9 on: April 11, 2017, 05:16:36 PM »

I'm afraid I can't help, but find myself in a similar position. I'm waiting for a Cristal in July, too, and was intending to pick it up at Le Son Continu, where I think BG unburdens himself of most of his crop. However, we're committed elsewhere for the Bastille Day weekend, and will have to make some other arrangement - either to pick it up from La Chapelle or have it sent. The first isn't easy for us unless we drive right across France, so it may well be the second. I was planning on contacting him nearer the time, but I'd be interested in how you get on. Chris Ryall may have a comment?

Best

Roger
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Stiamh

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Re: Bertrand Galliard Accordion Shipping Process
« Reply #10 on: April 11, 2017, 05:53:39 PM »

BTW Chris in case that was not just a typo, yer man's name is Gaillard (guy-yar) and not Galliard (gally-ard).

I don't think you need worry too much about damage in transit if you have it shipped. He packs his instruments well and insures them fully and uses reliable couriers. You would have to pay a brokerage fee in addition to whatever you would pay if you brought it in yourself - but this would be considerably less than the cost of a plane ticket...  (:)

Grape Ape

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Re: Bertrand Galliard Accordion Shipping Process
« Reply #11 on: April 11, 2017, 09:33:08 PM »

I have no experience physically bringing a box into the states but have had many sent and have never been asked to pay anything in terms of import or taxes.  Mind you I also didn't offer.
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Matthew B

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Re: Bertrand Galliard Accordion Shipping Process
« Reply #12 on: April 12, 2017, 04:10:11 AM »

I've brought many boxes across the water over the years.  Some were carried, some shipped, some new, some old-but-restored-by-experts and some just plain old.  Make your own matrix of all the possibilities.

My advice is "don't fight City Hall".  The cost difference between dodging taxes by trickery and just paying "The Man" up front is minimal compared to the value of your instrument.

And it is also minimal compared to the fines, confiscations, criminal proceedings and so on you may have to deal with if it all goes horribly wrong. 

Think it through: how many hours do you spend practicing, playing, performing . . . .?     

And what are you talking about in terms of value in dollars for a bespoke instrument made for you by a master?

And the tax burden?

Play one extra gig, and the difference is covered.
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odonovanchris

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Re: Bertrand Galliard Accordion Shipping Process
« Reply #13 on: April 12, 2017, 05:18:33 AM »

Thanks all for the advice (and spelling correction haha!)

I might just play it safe and have him ship it to me. I'm sure he does this on a regular basis so there shouldn't be a major concern. I will let you all know how it goes. I had a Paolo Soprani shipped to me from Australia a couple years ago and the import taxes were significant enough to be more concerned about the Gaillard  :||:

Nice to hear that you're also buying one Roger. Well worth the wait. Many years from now these will probably be considered the new "old grey" so it's an investment worth considering :)

I'll probably have a couple of boxes for sale soon to pay for this, so keep an eye on the buy&sell section:)

Cheers,
Chris
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Andrius

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Re: Bertrand Galliard Accordion Shipping Process
« Reply #14 on: April 12, 2017, 06:57:30 AM »

when importing from USA to Lithuania duties are about 21% from original price and shipping costs (and insurance if insured) together. It's the same for new or used instruments. Formally it's called "to avoid of goods non-European origin". It was impossible to prove that 100 years old Hohner boxes are European origin...
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Chris Ryall

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Re: Bertrand Galliard Accordion Shipping Process
« Reply #15 on: April 12, 2017, 12:17:33 PM »

Bertrand times all builds to CH.d'Ars festival and sells/delivers 80%+ of his production there. 

If you live in EU you can simply pay French TVA(VAT) at 20%, pick up at festival and toddle home with it.   He is 'very busy' in the month prior to the festival but you could pick up (near the mouth of the Loire).  Post festival he always seems to go on to Italy.

Non-EU buyers should email him -  he is very experienced in dealing with the issue and speaks excellent english - especially where melodeons are concerned.  Check when the tax refund desk at your chosen airport  is open! Leaving Puglia airport yesterday (10.45 am) it was SHUT - so assume nothing.

British Nationals (+/- Scots and Londoners) will be in the same situation as externals post 29/3/19,  and those regulations are horrendously complex. eg Different rates for all instrument types - see https://www.gov.uk/trade-tariff/commodities/9207909000

Generally then it's ...

1. reclaim foreign tax (if you can)
2. Add duty on the instrument - all are different - but seem to be 2.5-3.5% in general
3. Then add UK 20% VAT on the [price+duty]
4. Return all necessary documentation. eg in 1991 I had specifically to certify that
    my incoming accordion was 'not Italian ceramics/glass' - I kid you not!! 

I'd recommend collect and carry if poss as you can  add in a very pleasant holiday (can advise), but see Stiamh's post, and also his tribulations when he imported. Note that if you don't specify 'bandoneon' then Gaillard tuning is on the dry side.

eg http://forum.melodeon.net/index.php/topic,14895.msg183724.html#msg183724
   http://forum.melodeon.net/index.php/topic,2880.msg33203.html#msg33203 (tuning)

Personally I am presently looking for a job and pied a terre within the wider EU and hope to avoid all this bureaucracy ;)
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