Topic: Models with Binci reeds (Read 16603 times)

Steve C. · « **Reply #60 on:** February 01, 2018, 03:29:31 PM »

Pete, what's the difference between "machina" and SuperDural? I'm not sure I have heard of "machina" before, I thought SD was the bottom of the "decent" reed business.

Steve_freereeder · « **Reply #61 on:** February 01, 2018, 04:17:44 PM »

I believe SuperDural reeds are one step up in quality from 'macchina' reeds. I think the main difference is that macchina reed plates are made from a softer aluminium and the reed tongue riveting is different - domed head finish as opposed to flat head finish on SD reeds. Also the gap around the sides and tip of the reed tongue may not be quite to such a fine tolerance on the macchina reeds.

There is a comparison chart for Voci Armoniche reeds (used by Castagnari) here. Macchina reeds seem now to be designated 'Tipo C'.
http://www.vociarmoniche.it/tabella.php?p=6

Steve_freereeder · « **Reply #62 on:** February 01, 2018, 04:22:14 PM »

Quote from: melodeon on February 01, 2018, 03:07:37 PM

I have enjoyed the TAM reeds on my Castagnaris and never felt the need for an "upgrade".

I like the SANDER and the CIACY and can imagine that TAM reeds would make them very fine accordeons. I don't believe that BINCI reeds would be necessary and might even change the character of the box.

Exactly!
Some years ago I had an older Sander in the days when Castagnari were still using Antonelli reeds. It had been upgraded to TAM reeds and was a really good instrument with great response. It was virtually the equivalent of the Hascy of its day.

Andy in Vermont · « **Reply #63 on:** February 01, 2018, 05:24:55 PM »

I thought Castagnari’s higher-end boxes have been fitted with TAM as standard since at least the time when I first started looking into getting one in 2001—at least that was what the catalogue and price list indicated that they sent me at the time. I recall that a mani “upgrade” was an option. I don’t find it surprising that if they felt that a mani led to too many returns, it was time to give up the option.

To the original topic of this thread, I’ve owned a Gaillard and two Mélodies that were fitted with Bincis as standard.

melodeon · « **Reply #64 on:** February 01, 2018, 06:11:00 PM »

I have owned three accordeons with Binci reeds.. I sold all three.

One was the Clement Breton.. I liked it but not the tuning.

I had two custom made CAJUN accordeons.

The workmanship was substandard, as was the action/playability, and tuning was not so good. Sold them both.
As to the sound, loud and brash.

-Y- · « **Reply #65 on:** February 01, 2018, 07:22:21 PM »

What I was commenting on Castagnari change towards TAM is not the fact that they fitted TAM instead of AM (I'm not that sure that reeds are that influential on sound quality, the quality of the air column is more important), but the fact the price did not follow accordingly.
For AM, they fitted the 18 basses Handry with them (at leAST it was the case for French dealers).

Andy in Vermont · « **Reply #66 on:** February 01, 2018, 08:08:46 PM »

Y,
I’m guessing the AM was ordered at the dealers option and reflected in the price to the dealers to begin with.

I’m pretty sure my 2001 price list for direct sale indicated TAM for Handry 18.

-Y- · « **Reply #67 on:** February 01, 2018, 09:32:59 PM »

You're perfectly right Andy, this must have been a French dealership policy then. Funny enough I experienced the tuning instability when I got my Handry, it's reassuring to know it was not only mine...

Andy in Vermont · « **Reply #68 on:** February 01, 2018, 09:43:53 PM »

Can anyone explain why a mano reeds can exhibit tuning instability? What causes tuning instability with new reeds?

Steve C. · « **Reply #69 on:** February 02, 2018, 01:13:51 PM »

While on the subject of reeds, does this article make sense?

http://www.concertinaconnection.com/concertina%20reeds.htm

And if it does, how is the pressure vs. "suction" affect accounted for in tuning/setting the reeds in reed blocks on melodeons?

My medical physics and ME classes were so long in the ethers of time that I can't remember if pressure vs. suction is bs.

I would think it would make the "cheaper" reeds more responsive?

-Y- · « **Reply #70 on:** February 03, 2018, 03:10:11 PM »

From what I gather from the link you gave, suction and such would only affect the transient regime (i.e. the response of the reed), not the steady state, which I believe is used to tune the reed. But that's as far as my physics knowledge reach

Charles Valashan · « **Reply #71 on:** December 26, 2019, 06:34:39 PM »

I just had a top of the line 5/5 accordion made by Vignoni in Castelfidardo (big mistake) and it had Binci reeds (not what I specified). I am VERY disappointed. The sound is not special and the voicing of the reeds is terrible - I can't play softly because not all not notes will respond reliably - notes drop out or start to sound at different pressure. Bassoon is sluggish and high notes weak. Hand made may not be better in today's world.

Lester · « **Reply #72 on:** December 26, 2019, 06:37:18 PM »

Quote from: Charles Valashan on December 26, 2019, 06:34:39 PM

The sound is not special and the voicing of the reeds is terrible - I can't play softly because not all not notes will respond reliably - notes drop out or start to sound at different pressure. Bassoon is sluggish and high notes weak. Hand made may not be better in today's world.

Most of this could probably be fixed by a decent fettler setting the reeds correctly

mselic · « **Reply #73 on:** December 26, 2019, 07:01:51 PM »

Quote from: Lester on December 26, 2019, 06:37:18 PM

Quote from: Charles Valashan on December 26, 2019, 06:34:39 PM
The sound is not special and the voicing of the reeds is terrible - I can't play softly because not all not notes will respond reliably - notes drop out or start to sound at different pressure. Bassoon is sluggish and high notes weak. Hand made may not be better in today's world.
Most of this could probably be fixed by a decent fettler setting the reeds correctly

Agreed. It sounds like, at the very least, your instrument is not set up properly. Also, if what you received is not what you specified with the maker, a good place to start would be to take your concerns directly to them.

Microbot · « **Reply #74 on:** December 26, 2019, 09:29:50 PM »

Hi Charles, Lester and all,

[/quote]
Most of this could probably be fixed by a decent fettler setting the reeds correctly
[/quote]

I don't like to disagree with Lester, but I think Charles is making an important point.

I've worked on reeds that ought to have been (from the price paid and spec) a lot better than they were... And no adjustment to the 'set' or profile would draw out a better response. The tolerance, or the metal quality, was simply not what I expected.

Meanwhile, I have worked on factory-made reeds on older boxes (Salterelles and Castas from the 1990s and many vintage Hohners) that were simply fantastic.

If you order an instrument with top quality reeds, you shouldn't have to get a fettler to 'put them right'....

Regards

Mike R

Lester · « **Reply #75 on:** December 26, 2019, 09:33:42 PM »

Quote from: Microbot on December 26, 2019, 09:29:50 PM

Hi Charles, Lester and all,
Most of this could probably be fixed by a decent fettler setting the reeds correctly
I don't like to disagree with Lester, but I think Charles is making an important point.

I've worked on reeds that ought to have been (from the price paid and spec) a lot better than they were... And no adjustment to the 'set' or profile would draw out a better response. The tolerance, or the metal quality, was simply not what I expected.

Meanwhile, I have worked on factory-made reeds on older boxes (Salterelles and Castas from the 1990s and many vintage Hohners) that were simply fantastic.

If you order an instrument with top quality reeds, you shouldn't have to get a fettler to 'put them right'....

Regards

Mike R

Maybe I made my point badly, what I meant was the problems with the box were not necessarily with the reed quality but with manufacture's tuning/setup quality control.

Microbot · « **Reply #76 on:** December 26, 2019, 10:08:44 PM »

Hi Lester,

My turn to apologise ...it's not that you were wrong in the point you made. A fettler might well be able to improve the reed response. That's well worth trying.

It's just I have suffered the same disappointment, and been unable to address the issue to my satisfaction. You can get sets of reeds that I'd simply categorise as 'poor'.

My experience .... I ordered a set of 'a Mano professional' reeds from a maker whose reeds I had used before, and had really rated. But this set just had no 'life' in them....nothing I could do would get the same vitality as the previous set.

I've also ordered sets where I simply waxed them in, and with no fine-tuning or adjustment, they were outstanding, without even being played in.

I just wanted to flag up that Charles is raising an important point about variable quality, of products which we have a right to expect to be consistent.

Cheers Lester!

Mike

richard.fleming · « **Reply #77 on:** December 27, 2019, 09:54:53 AM »

I've Binci reeds fitted in a classic Paolo Soprani by Rees Wesson and they are just the best I've ever played.

Theo · « **Reply #78 on:** December 27, 2019, 11:51:44 AM »

It’s all very puzzling. I know several people with Vignoni PAs and the playing quality is consistently excellent. I’ve also tuned and set up thousands (not exaggerating) Binci reeds on Emmanuel’s courses and and apart from the rare individual reed that is defective the quality is consistently excellent. I can only guess that perhaps Mr Vignoni has had to find a new person to install and tune reeds.
Whatever the reason it’s only fair to the maker to take any problems to him so he can learn from them and put things right for you and future customers.

Rog · « **Reply #79 on:** December 27, 2019, 11:53:44 PM »

Do Binci have a range of qualities like CAGNONI and Harmonikas or are they just made to one specification and finish?

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Author Topic: Models with Binci reeds (Read 16603 times)