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Author Topic: P Soprani's Age  (Read 971 times)

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AnBec

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P Soprani's Age
« on: February 23, 2019, 02:27:41 PM »

Hi, my name is Angel. I've been in the forum for a few weeks but I still had not written anything. I live in the south of Spain and I play a little Irish music and music from Asturias.

A few days ago I got a Paolo Soprani CF, very good instrument, a little heavy but I'm very happy. As I read in this forum the red badge is from the 50's-60's, but when I opened it and looked inside to check the condition I saw that the woods look as new and the pallets are made of green plastic. For me It is a bit strange. Could someone help me to know when the instrument was built?

On the other hand, I have seen in some valves with a small red circle. Would anyone know what it means?

Thanks in advance
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Angel Bec

pgroff

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Re: P Soprani's Age
« Reply #1 on: February 23, 2019, 03:03:51 PM »

Probably 1970s, based on discussions with a lot of experts about my C#D with very similar features and trim.
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Pearse Rossa

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Re: P Soprani's Age
« Reply #2 on: February 23, 2019, 05:11:00 PM »

Currently I have three Paolos. Two from late 1950s/early '60s. One of them has the green plastic pallets,
but the mechanism is very different to the mech. on yours. The other one has wooden pallets.
My third Paolo is late 1970s and also has the green plastic pallets. So, I don't think you can determine its age
solely on the basis of the type of pallets it has.
The red badge did come into being in the '50s/'60s, but has continued up to the present day.
You also have black badge models. So, the badge in itself is only an indicator of age, combined with other features.
I think Paul is correct. Your Paolo has the look of a late '60s/early to mid '70s about it.
That particular script type is indicative of that period I would say. The company did produce some fine instruments during that time.
I see yours is a 3-voice. At least that keeps the weight down somewhat, and it does appear to be in excellent condition.

I am not sure what you mean by the following;
Quote
I have seen in some valves with a small red circle.

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AnBec

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Re: P Soprani's Age
« Reply #3 on: February 23, 2019, 07:25:38 PM »

Thank you very much for your replies. I thought that it could be a Soprani-Baffetti of the last ones, but I see that it is an real Soprani. I have been lucky because he is in a very good condition (inside and outside). Now I know that knowing the exact age will be difficult, not like Hohner.

About the red circle in the valves. As soon as accordion arrived I opened it just to see that everything is fine and I took some quick photos. Now I have watched again the photos and I have seen that some valves have a small metal reinforcement and is stuck with a red sticker. (I add a photo)

PS: Sorry for my English, it's not my mother tongue and I still make some mistakes.
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Angel Bec

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Re: P Soprani's Age
« Reply #4 on: February 23, 2019, 08:28:32 PM »

Be great to hear it.
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Re: P Soprani's Age
« Reply #5 on: February 23, 2019, 09:27:05 PM »

Is that varnish I see in the picture of the reedblock?
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pgroff

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Re: P Soprani's Age
« Reply #6 on: February 23, 2019, 10:11:16 PM »

Currently I have three Paolos. Two from late 1950s/early '60s. One of them has the green plastic pallets,
but the mechanism is very different to the mech. on yours. The other one has wooden pallets.
My third Paolo is late 1970s and also has the green plastic pallets. So, I don't think you can determine its age
solely on the basis of the type of pallets it has.
The red badge did come into being in the '50s/'60s, but has continued up to the present day.
You also have black badge models. So, the badge in itself is only an indicator of age, combined with other features.
I think Paul is correct. Your Paolo has the look of a late '60s/early to mid '70s about it.
That particular script type is indicative of that period I would say. The company did produce some fine instruments during that time.
I see yours is a 3-voice. At least that keeps the weight down somewhat, and it does appear to be in excellent condition.



Thanks Pearse Rossa, Martin Connolly and a few others weighed in to date this one (below). It's a C#D and probably a little later (younger) than the similar box once owned by  Johnny O'Leary (R. I. P.). Johnny's box was possibly from around 1972 but has a bit more fretwork on either side of the couplers. So mine might be from mid 1970s.

The buttons on mine have now been replaced. Some were cracking and crumbling. I understand that around this period, the buttons on Paolos like mine were often made of a particularly unstable batch of celluloid. The buttons on earlier ones, and also the buttons on later ones, were made of a better material. But now with the new buttons I love this box.  Still in factory tuning too - a friend of mine who often played with Joe Cooley in California (and Joe played at his wedding) said "that sounds exactly like Cooley's accordion!" Cooley had a couple of red boxes during his California years, not exactly this model (his were earlier), but for some reason mine has a very similar tuning and response. Very bright in the treble.

PG
« Last Edit: February 24, 2019, 12:36:38 AM by pgroff »
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Pearse Rossa

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Re: P Soprani's Age
« Reply #7 on: February 24, 2019, 02:27:51 PM »

Now I know that knowing the exact age will be difficult, not like Hohner.
I think you have been given a fairly accurate estimate there, and I'm not sure that it's any easier for Hohner models.
If you expected an exact year; I think it is impossible for anyone to say precisely.
You could try to trace its previous owner(s) and see if they can provide any additional information.
You might get lucky and someone will produce an original purchase receipt or some such document.

Quote
I play a little Irish music
I don't mean to cause you any anxiety, but the key of C/F would not be most people's first choice for Irish music.
You probably know that already.

Quote
Sorry for my English, it's not my mother tongue and I still make some mistakes.
I wouldn't worry about it too much. English is not my first language either. We get by alright all the same!
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Steve_freereeder

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Re: P Soprani's Age
« Reply #8 on: February 24, 2019, 03:46:10 PM »

On the other hand, I have seen in some valves with a small red circle. Would anyone know what it means?
The red disk is there to hold the thin steel spring in place. The disks and springs help the larger valves to remain closed until they are opened by air pressure when the reed is sounded.
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Steve
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catty

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Re: P Soprani's Age
« Reply #9 on: February 24, 2019, 07:21:23 PM »

Lovely instrument.  I have a Hohner Norma in much the same configuration - which was the best I could do in pursuit of the nicest small club-style I could find (in the small size - didnt want to go with heavier Overtuere size).

*Would enjoying hearing it!
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AnBec

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Re: P Soprani's Age
« Reply #10 on: February 24, 2019, 09:11:11 PM »

Now I know that knowing the exact age will be difficult, not like Hohner.
I think you have been given a fairly accurate estimate there, and I'm not sure that it's any easier for Hohner models.
If you expected an exact year; I think it is impossible for anyone to say precisely.
You could try to trace its previous owner(s) and see if they can provide any additional information.
You might get lucky and someone will produce an original purchase receipt or some such document.

I have readen in the Hohner website that since 1930 their accordions have a reference number and you can know when they were manufactured. But I have never checked this service  https://www.hohner.de/en/service/accordion/faqs

I play a little Irish music
I don't mean to cause you any anxiety, but the key of C/F would not be most people's first choice for Irish music.
You probably know that already.

You do not cause me anxiety, to see Terry Bingham play and not be able to imitate him if it causes me anxiety lol.
For Irish music I use a new Hohner BC enhanced and tuned by Martin Quinn. It is not a Soprani nor an old Hohner but it is enough for me (for now). Then I got an old Hohner Vienna (or similar I do not know the exact model) of the 30s "detuned" in CF, and with that I started to play Asturian music with bagpipes. It's fun because using the C row in all my accordions I can play some Asturian and some Irish tunes (Am or G)

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Angel Bec

AnBec

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Re: P Soprani's Age
« Reply #11 on: February 24, 2019, 09:16:48 PM »

Is that varnish I see in the picture of the reedblock?

Yes, it is varnished. The trebles and the bass reedblocks. I have also seen it in other photos of P Soprani. The rest of the wood inside is natural.

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Angel Bec

Winston Smith

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Re: P Soprani's Age
« Reply #12 on: February 24, 2019, 09:20:31 PM »

Queer! I wonder if it was from the factory, anyone know?
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Pearse Rossa

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Re: P Soprani's Age
« Reply #13 on: February 24, 2019, 10:10:08 PM »

For Irish music I use a new Hohner BC enhanced and tuned by Martin Quinn.
Now you're talking my language!
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