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Author Topic: Shoe-horn a C# reed into 20 key Anglo concertina?  (Read 1530 times)

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RogerT

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Shoe-horn a C# reed into 20 key Anglo concertina?
« on: July 20, 2018, 07:17:45 AM »

Has anyone tried substituting the low pull D for a C# on the G row of a 20key CG Anglo concertina? This note is repeated (D pull) on the C row so it seems to me you lose nothing, but gain the ability to play a full D scale.
I tried asking this on concertina.net but so far haven’t had any response (maybe it’s a heresy  (:) )

Anahata

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Re: Shoe-horn a C# reed into 20 key Anglo concertina?
« Reply #1 on: July 20, 2018, 08:33:40 AM »

I couldn't understand what you meant for a moment, then I remembered that my current and previous Anglos have had that button changed to A. (they are three row instruments so don't need a C♯ there, but the A is nice to have)
So at least there is some precedent for changing that button from D pull to something else.

Warning: you'll be wanting a C♯ an octave higher then!
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Tone Dumb Greg

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Re: Shoe-horn a C# reed into 20 key Anglo concertina?
« Reply #2 on: July 20, 2018, 08:55:38 AM »

Has anyone tried substituting the low pull D for a C# on the G row of a 20key CG Anglo concertina? This note is repeated (D pull) on the C row so it seems to me you lose nothing, but gain the ability to play a full D scale.
I tried asking this on concertina.net but so far haven’t had any response (maybe it’s a heresy  (:) )

I have tried to persuade two fettlers to do this and they were both so discouraging it never happened. It should be so easy, though...
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Greg Smith
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RogerT

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Re: Shoe-horn a C# reed into 20 key Anglo concertina?
« Reply #3 on: July 20, 2018, 09:25:09 AM »

Yes I agree, so I'm going to give it a go. Since I posted Chris Ghent on Conc.net has given a good analysis and suggests using a right hand top G button and mod the chamber to take middle C#/C#, which involves a bit more work but sounds attractive.
Chris' objection to the substitution is the difficulty in making it work properly. He suggests a 30 key, which is obviously the way to go (I have had two in the past). But I like the compactness of the 20key Jones. And I've just had two new ends made for it (:).
Anahata ... on the 20key there is no push A ...so that would be nice...if it was a push A.

Theo

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Re: Shoe-horn a C# reed into 20 key Anglo concertina?
« Reply #4 on: July 20, 2018, 09:44:17 AM »

Rather than put the C# in the top button, I would put it on button 1 and move all the other reeds one place to the right.  That would put the C# in a position closer to where it would be on a 30 key, and you can probably get away without altering reed chambers, and probably only minor changes to some reed slots.
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Tone Dumb Greg

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Re: Shoe-horn a C# reed into 20 key Anglo concertina?
« Reply #5 on: July 20, 2018, 09:46:41 AM »

Yes I agree, so I'm going to give it a go. Since I posted Chris Ghent on Conc.net has given a good analysis and suggests using a right hand top G button and mod the chamber to take middle C#/C#, which involves a bit more work but sounds attractive.
Chris' objection to the substitution is the difficulty in making it work properly. He suggests a 30 key, which is obviously the way to go (I have had two in the past). But I like the compactness of the 20key Jones. And I've just had two new ends made for it (:).
Anahata ... on the 20key there is no push A ...so that would be nice...if it was a push A.

Funnily enough, mine is a 20 key Jones. I think my fettlers were reluctant to go playing carpenter with a functioning 150 year old instrument. Interested in knowing how this works out.
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Greg Smith
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RogerT

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Re: Shoe-horn a C# reed into 20 key Anglo concertina?
« Reply #6 on: July 20, 2018, 11:35:06 AM »

Rather than put the C# in the top button, I would put it on button 1 and move all the other reeds one place to the right.  That would put the C# in a position closer to where it would be on a 30 key, and you can probably get away without altering reed chambers, and probably only minor changes to some reed slots.
Now then! This is what is needed. A bit of creative thinking. Thanks Theo. I'll take a closer look to see how viable this is..

RogerT

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Re: Shoe-horn a C# reed into 20 key Anglo concertina?
« Reply #7 on: September 19, 2018, 05:59:04 PM »

Update: On my 20 key Jones I substituted the pull A on the LH G row for C#. The reed pretty much went straight in. This seems to be an acceptable way to gain that all important C#. I play across the rows (as in the Bramich book), so G scale/tunes is mostly on the C row until I get to the top E or F#. The position of this C# feels very natural too. And I have pull A on the LH C row top button...so the G row GA button is actually duplicated on the C row.
« Last Edit: September 19, 2018, 06:00:59 PM by RogerT »
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Tone Dumb Greg

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Re: Shoe-horn a C# reed into 20 key Anglo concertina?
« Reply #8 on: September 19, 2018, 06:02:23 PM »

Update: On my 20 key Jones I substituted the pull A on the LH G row for C#. The reed pretty much went straight in. This seems to be an acceptable way to gain that all important C#. I play across the rows (as in the Bramich book), so G scale/tunes is mostly on the C row until I get to the top E or F#. The position of this C# feels very natural too.

Can I have one to match, please? Anyone?
I have asked a couple fettlers for this and they don't want to do it. Seems like common sense to me. They don't want to make it none standard.
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Greg Smith
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RogerT

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Re: Shoe-horn a C# reed into 20 key Anglo concertina?
« Reply #9 on: September 19, 2018, 06:55:05 PM »

What 20 key have you got?

Tone Dumb Greg

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Re: Shoe-horn a C# reed into 20 key Anglo concertina?
« Reply #10 on: September 19, 2018, 07:02:16 PM »

What 20 key have you got?
A Jones Sally Army special from mid to late 19th C (I think about 1870s, but I can't remember).
I did have the serial number, but I can't find it. Have to dig it out
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Greg Smith
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RogerT

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Re: Shoe-horn a C# reed into 20 key Anglo concertina?
« Reply #11 on: September 19, 2018, 08:15:48 PM »

Um...perhaps PM me?
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