Melodeon.net Forums

Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Advanced search  

News:

Welcome to the new melodeon.net forum

Pages: 1 2 3 4 5 6 [7] 8 9   Go Down

Author Topic: Tune of the Month for March 2019: Origin of the World  (Read 10904 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Eshed

  • Respected Sage
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 323
Re: Tune of the Month for March 2019: Origin of the World
« Reply #120 on: March 26, 2019, 08:18:31 PM »

...maybe people should just take the license to play it how they want...? It's folk music after all...
It's like free speech, people can play whatever they want, however they want, but there's no obligation to listen to them. 
There's a clear difference between deviating from a source due to a conscious choice, due to musical evolution and due to negligence.
Logged
I'm playing all the wrong notes but not necessarily in the wrong order.

Thrupenny Bit

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 4772
  • happily squeezing away in Devon
Re: Tune of the Month for March 2019: Origin of the World
« Reply #121 on: March 26, 2019, 08:34:44 PM »

Yes, I agree Saul.
Q
Logged
Thrupenny Bit

I think I'm starting to get most of the notes in roughly the right order...... sometimes!

Tone Dumb Greg

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Online Online
  • Posts: 2243
  • DG Pokerwork, DG 2.4 Saltarelle, CF Hohner, 1040C
    • Dartmoor Border Morris
Re: Tune of the Month for March 2019: Origin of the World
« Reply #122 on: March 26, 2019, 09:09:31 PM »

...maybe people should just take the license to play it how they want...? It's folk music after all...
It's like free speech, people can play whatever they want, however they want, but there's no obligation to listen to them. 
There's a clear difference between deviating from a source due to a conscious choice, due to musical evolution and due to negligence.

I feel compelled to point out, there are only two notes being objected to here. However, if you compare the setting in the Blowzabella tune book with what Blowzabella actually play there are loads of differences. If I had paid money for the tune book expecting to find their version of the tune I would be far more disappointed than coming across two wrong notes in a score, noted by ear, posted on line.
Logged
Greg Smith
Is not the space between Heaven and Earth like a bellows?
It is empty, but lacks nothing.
The more it moves, the more comes out of it.
Lao Tzu

Dick Rees

  • Respected Sage
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 363
Re: Tune of the Month for March 2019: Origin of the World
« Reply #123 on: March 26, 2019, 10:16:11 PM »

Begging your indulgence and forgiveness in advance, I'll post my own very personal outlook with 70+ years of hindsight.  One of my mentors for whom I played guitar and with whom I learned the fiddle put it this way:

"With the fiddle the left hand is the artisan, the right hand the artist."
...Joseph LaBrosse

  Given the similarities between the bow and the bellows, I translate/transpose this to the accordion as the right hand is the artisan, the left hand the artist.  And as both fiddler and box-skweezer I would call attention to phrasing, articulation and dynamics as being the essential elements of musicality.

 Music is more than playing the right notes in the right order.



« Last Edit: March 26, 2019, 10:18:21 PM by Dick Rees »
Logged
It's the carpenter, not the hammer...and a poor workman who blames his tools.

playandteach

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2524
  • Currently a music teacher in a high school.
Re: Tune of the Month for March 2019: Origin of the World
« Reply #124 on: March 26, 2019, 11:47:27 PM »

I fully understand your point, Dick.
Though I retain the right not to worry about even the right notes in the right order. Otherwise I might as well go and do something that I'm good at (but perhaps mightn't enjoy as much).
[At this point I should use some sort of emoticon to show my good nature, great sense of humour etc. but I can't bring myself to use them - emoticons that is. Or even exclamation marks, apparently - just tried but I'm hardwired against them.]
Looking forward to the next TOTM already.
Logged
Serafini R2D2 GC, Castagnari Sander DG

Stiamh

  • Senior member at meloldieon.net
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Online Online
  • Posts: 2940
    • Packie Manus Byrne
Re: Tune of the Month for March 2019: Origin of the World
« Reply #125 on: March 26, 2019, 11:56:04 PM »

I feel compelled to point out, there are only two notes being objected to here.

You're making me giggle with your two wrong notes, Greg. Two wrong notes may not seem like much to a statistician or an accountant, but what they add up to in this case is a musical phrase that makes no sense, goes nowhere, lets the tune die in mid flow. In such a well crafted tune the phrase stands out like a boil on a beautiful face.

That is what is being objected to. Personally, I couldn't give a fig for how many other little differences there are between that transcription and what is in the tunebook. Play the transcription as written and you get a lovely tune - except for that aberration that you are passing off as a minor faff or less than three wrong notes  ;)

I defy you to play the tune with that phrase in it and make it sound like there isn't something gravely amiss!

Fred

  • Respected Sage
  • ****
  • Online Online
  • Posts: 466
  • Loffet Graet e Breizh D/G and various Hohners
Re: Tune of the Month for March 2019: Origin of the World
« Reply #126 on: March 26, 2019, 11:59:00 PM »

Or even exclamation marks, apparently - just tried but I'm hardwired against them.

I strongly agree with Mr. Pratchett on this issue:

"The basic idea is that a person's sanity is inversely proportional to the number of exclamation marks they use
[...]
'And all those exclamation marks, you notice? Five? A sure sign of someone who wears his underpants on his head.'"
Source

So keep your pure sanity, pnt, as you rightfully refuse to use any exclamation marks.
Logged

Tone Dumb Greg

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Online Online
  • Posts: 2243
  • DG Pokerwork, DG 2.4 Saltarelle, CF Hohner, 1040C
    • Dartmoor Border Morris
Re: Tune of the Month for March 2019: Origin of the World
« Reply #127 on: March 27, 2019, 12:17:51 AM »

I feel compelled to point out, there are only two notes being objected to here.

You're making me giggle with your two wrong notes, Greg. Two wrong notes may not seem like much to a statistician or an accountant, but what they add up to in this case is a musical phrase that makes no sense, goes nowhere, lets the tune die in mid flow. In such a well crafted tune the phrase stands out like a boil on a beautiful face.

That is what is being objected to. Personally, I couldn't give a fig for how many other little differences there are between that transcription and what is in the tunebook. Play the transcription as written and you get a lovely tune - except for that aberration that you are passing off as a minor faff or less than three wrong notes  ;)

I defy you to play the tune with that phrase in it and make it sound like there isn't something gravely amiss!

 ;D Yes. But they're pretty obviously wrong when you try to play them. Worse things happen at sea.

Edit: Actually, what I'm really thinking is , yes, it was an incorrectly transcribed phrase but that's fairly trivial. I spotted it straight away and found it straight forward to sort out. What is really bugging me is that I prefer the way  Blowzabella play this tune, as a group, to the way that Mr Shepherd does it in other performances. I have been trying to get their setting (which is driven by Gregory's playing) off for most of the month but, for some reason, it is defeating me. I hoped that eyeballing the score from the Blowzabella tunebook would help, but it's left me no wiser. I am sure it's a copyright thing but it frustrates me.
« Last Edit: March 27, 2019, 12:54:26 AM by Tone Dumb Greg »
Logged
Greg Smith
Is not the space between Heaven and Earth like a bellows?
It is empty, but lacks nothing.
The more it moves, the more comes out of it.
Lao Tzu

Thrupenny Bit

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 4772
  • happily squeezing away in Devon
Re: Tune of the Month for March 2019: Origin of the World
« Reply #128 on: March 27, 2019, 07:17:17 AM »

I've already stated my point that things - tunes - mutate in the wild, and as Saul says, it is folk music.
But.... I suppose it depends on *which* notes or phrases have mutated.
I'm reminded of a favourite tune, Brass Monkey's version of The Waterman's Hornpipe. The tune ( in G ) revolves around a low F nat. Get that wrong and the essence of the tune is lost.
You can fudge/mutate/corrupt other notes in the tune, but not that note and phrase!
Q

Logged
Thrupenny Bit

I think I'm starting to get most of the notes in roughly the right order...... sometimes!

Eshed

  • Respected Sage
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 323
Re: Tune of the Month for March 2019: Origin of the World
« Reply #129 on: March 27, 2019, 08:37:06 AM »

I feel compelled to point out, there are only two notes being objected to here. However, if you compare the setting in the Blowzabella tune book with what Blowzabella actually play there are loads of differences. If I had paid money for the tune book expecting to find their version of the tune I would be far more disappointed than coming across two wrong notes in a score, noted by ear, posted on line.
This was never aimed at you, as your response wasn't "Don't tell me how to play things, this is folk music!" but
;D Yes. But they're pretty obviously wrong when you try to play them. Worse things happen at sea.
It's likely that I make mistakes more than anyone else in this thread. It'll be preposterous to say I'm playing superbly just because it's folk music.
Similarly, I suspect many of you have seen a guitar player with a chords book they've printed off of the internet playing songs with their eyes only, giving their ears a rest. This is not music, folk or other, this is just eye-hand practice.
We don't get a carte blanche to play folk music in any conceivable way we want, only in ways that make sense or sound good. It might be that to Saul, who has more musical talent that I could ever hope of achieving, these are nearly the same, as it's truly inconceivable that he'd want play in a way that doesn't sound good. For us mere mortals, that is not the case.
Logged
I'm playing all the wrong notes but not necessarily in the wrong order.

Julian S

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 652
  • D/G Pastourelle 2, Dony, Giordy, Binci etc
Re: Tune of the Month for March 2019: Origin of the World
« Reply #130 on: March 27, 2019, 09:06:00 AM »

When I started playing many moons ago, I learned virtually everything by ear - there weren't many tunebooks available for one thing ! I'm sure I ended up mislearning loads of tunes (or putting my own version together I suppose), but for me the priority was to make the tune feel 'right' (whatever that means). Yep, important to get most of the right notes in the right(ish) order but there is much more to think about. For me the dots are a guide and starting point.
I don't think I have achieved my goal with this months tune, not because of whether I have hit the notes, but because the tune doesn't quite gel yet. And I agree with the comment about the Blowza vs Shepherd versions.
I'm pretty certain that quite a number of us have learned and maybe improved through playing the tune - I think I have, not least because of the amount of time I devoted to it. Thats great in itself.

I suppose I'd better go and relearn Tabletop and overrule my fiddler friend who prefers the wrong notes... >:E

J
Logged

Thrupenny Bit

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 4772
  • happily squeezing away in Devon
Re: Tune of the Month for March 2019: Origin of the World
« Reply #131 on: March 27, 2019, 09:29:21 AM »

.... and surely if Blowzabella, with a lineup of stunning musicians including Andy Cutting *and* Dave Shepherd himself play it slightly different to the quoted ' Dave Shepherd ' version doesn't that speak volumes about following strictly 'as writ' ?
I rest my case m'lud  ;)
Q
Logged
Thrupenny Bit

I think I'm starting to get most of the notes in roughly the right order...... sometimes!

Theo

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 11313
  • Hohner Club Too
    • The Box Place
Re: Tune of the Month for March 2019: Origin of the World
« Reply #132 on: March 27, 2019, 09:32:57 AM »

I think that’s called improvisation.
Logged
Theo Gibb - Gateshead UK

Proprietor of The Box Place for melodeon and concertina sales and service.
Follow me on Twitter and Facebook for stock updates.

Tone Dumb Greg

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Online Online
  • Posts: 2243
  • DG Pokerwork, DG 2.4 Saltarelle, CF Hohner, 1040C
    • Dartmoor Border Morris
Re: Tune of the Month for March 2019: Origin of the World
« Reply #133 on: March 27, 2019, 09:42:13 AM »

I think that’s called improvisation.

AKA Gregory Jolivet grabbing the tune by the throat  :D

I feel the same as Julian about this tune and my playing of it. It hasn't really gelled for me, yet. Time's running out.
Logged
Greg Smith
Is not the space between Heaven and Earth like a bellows?
It is empty, but lacks nothing.
The more it moves, the more comes out of it.
Lao Tzu

arty

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1140
Re: Tune of the Month for March 2019: Origin of the World
« Reply #134 on: March 27, 2019, 10:35:49 AM »

'
Time's running out.

If I may pass comment on this....I feel, at least sometimes, that a Tune a Month is too many. Some tunes take far longer and deserve much more time to get under the fingers. It also encourages people to rush, when really, everyone is capable of so much more if they want to put the work in. Add to this, the Theme of the Month and I think some feel they need to produce two recordings per month.
Surely, the whole idea of TOM is to encourage learning and improving as well as trying music, which is out of one’s comfort zone from time to time.
I would like to see much more encouragement for each other in the discussions. It is common to see a recording posted, (and we all know the time and effort involved to do this), only for it to be completely ignored by everyone on the site. We are all learning and we can all learn from each other. Let’s do that.
If it was just down to me, I think I would have a Theme of the Month every month and a specific Tune every other month.
I’m sorry and I feel I should wear a crash helmet now, I find the current bickering about a couple of errors in the abc all rather silly. It would be so much kinder and helpful, if those with greater musical knowledge used it to help those with less, rather than criticise the good hearted people who do help.
...maybe people should just take the license to play it how they want...? It's folk music after all...
Well said Saul...”how they want” - or, how your experience and present capabilities allow you to play it.
Logged
Pre-Pokerwork C/F, Castagnari Laura G/C, Beltuna Sara 3 A/D

Tone Dumb Greg

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Online Online
  • Posts: 2243
  • DG Pokerwork, DG 2.4 Saltarelle, CF Hohner, 1040C
    • Dartmoor Border Morris
Re: Tune of the Month for March 2019: Origin of the World
« Reply #135 on: March 27, 2019, 11:05:58 AM »

'
Time's running out.

If I may pass comment on this....I feel, at least sometimes, that a Tune a Month is too many.... Add to this, the Theme of the Month and I think some feel they need to produce two recordings per month.



Arty, I would regard TOTM as an opportunity made available, not something you have to do to be a part of it. I sometimes post The Tune and sometimes post The Theme (or something a bit like it). Sometimes I post both. Sometimes I post nothing. Others do the same.
Logged
Greg Smith
Is not the space between Heaven and Earth like a bellows?
It is empty, but lacks nothing.
The more it moves, the more comes out of it.
Lao Tzu

arty

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1140
Re: Tune of the Month for March 2019: Origin of the World
« Reply #136 on: March 27, 2019, 11:35:40 AM »

That is exactly what I do Greg, except I don’t take part very often as I play a G/C because my interest is mostly French music. I was making an observation of the recordings I see posted each month and by whom, that is all.
Logged
Pre-Pokerwork C/F, Castagnari Laura G/C, Beltuna Sara 3 A/D

Thrupenny Bit

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 4772
  • happily squeezing away in Devon
Re: Tune of the Month for March 2019: Origin of the World
« Reply #137 on: March 27, 2019, 12:09:40 PM »

For me just playing the tune is the start of a process of learning, not the end.
Q
Logged
Thrupenny Bit

I think I'm starting to get most of the notes in roughly the right order...... sometimes!

Thrupenny Bit

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 4772
  • happily squeezing away in Devon
Re: Tune of the Month for March 2019: Origin of the World
« Reply #138 on: March 27, 2019, 12:30:04 PM »

.... and like Greg sometimes I post, other times not.
I still take note and it often shows up tunes I've never heard, or tunes I've never considered playing until ToTM highlights it.
For me it's a worthwhile monthly browse, then my choice as to whether I join in or just make a mental note of a good tune to learn when I have the time.
Q
Logged
Thrupenny Bit

I think I'm starting to get most of the notes in roughly the right order...... sometimes!

Dick Rees

  • Respected Sage
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 363
Re: Tune of the Month for March 2019: Origin of the World
« Reply #139 on: March 27, 2019, 02:03:22 PM »

For me just playing the tune is the start of a process of learning, not the end.
Q

No matter how far we go, there is no end.  That's the fascination.
Logged
It's the carpenter, not the hammer...and a poor workman who blames his tools.
Pages: 1 2 3 4 5 6 [7] 8 9   Go Up
 


Melodeon.net - (c) Theo Gibb; Clive Williams 2010. The access and use of this website and forum featuring these terms and conditions constitutes your acceptance of these terms and conditions.