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Author Topic: Melodeon Playgroup 2020  (Read 8299 times)

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doctordoom

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Re: Melodeon Playgroup 2020
« Reply #40 on: February 09, 2020, 12:30:16 PM »

A big thanks to all Elves,  tutors and staff at the Fleece,  much appreciated the Playgroup weekend.
Remember anyone in the Bristol area  / North Somerset is very welcome at our Well known tunes at a steady pace  session in Pill Memorial club every 3rd Tuesday of the month at 8pm,  all melody instruments are welcome but melodeons are more welcome.
Misquote from Animal Farm!  Next booking is February 18th.
Hope to see you all next year,  cheers John du Heaume. 
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Helena Handcart

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Re: Melodeon Playgroup 2020
« Reply #41 on: February 09, 2020, 12:48:23 PM »

The journey from Skye was fine....the journey to Skye....well I'll cross that bridge when I come to it.

Ah, now if only there was a bridge your journey home would be easier.  Good to see you and Deó even if we didn't get a chance to share a plate of cheesy chips this year.
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Peadar

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Re: Melodeon Playgroup 2020
« Reply #42 on: February 12, 2020, 12:42:06 AM »

Taing Mhor- A big thanks to the elves, The Fleece and everyone else at Playgroup.
It was well worth the journey from Skye....not so sure about the journey back, which turned into a three day epic, with my intended route blocked/delayed at various points by flooding, high winds and snow. Got in an hour ago.
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Peadar

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Re: Melodeon Playgroup 2020
« Reply #43 on: February 20, 2020, 09:09:07 AM »

Lesson of the weekend...In an English session you ususally play a tune AABB x 3 Right??

When in e.g. Dorset 4 hand Reel the dots show a repeat at the end of the A and at the end of the B, is playing it straight through as written AABB or just AB?
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Lester

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Re: Melodeon Playgroup 2020
« Reply #44 on: February 20, 2020, 09:13:25 AM »

Lesson of the weekend...In an English session you ususally play a tune AABB x 3 Right??

When in e.g. Dorset 4 hand Reel the dots show a repeat at the end of the A and at the end of the B, is playing it straight through as written AABB or just AB?


Mostly we play 16 bar As and 16 bar Bs.
So if the A is written as 8 bars it's 2 As
If the A is written as 8 bars with repeats it's 1 A
If the A is a 16 bar it's 1 A.

Steve_freereeder

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Re: Melodeon Playgroup 2020
« Reply #45 on: February 20, 2020, 09:53:32 AM »

...In an English session you ususally play a tune AABB x 3 Right??
Further to Lester's reply - yes, the general custom these days is to play through a tune three times (including repeats) and then go on to a second tune, also played three times. It's up to the person who started the tune to call the changes. Sometimes - this happens at Whitby Folk Week English sessions, for example - if a particular tune is going really well and people are clearly enjoying it, we might play it perhaps 5 or 6 times.

However, it hasn't always been like that and it also depends where you are. When I lived in South Wales in the 1980s, the sessions I went to used to play 'two and two': tune 1 twice through, tune 2 twice through, tune 1 twice, tune 2 twice, etc. repeating the pattern perhaps three or four times. (Yes - I know it was Wales and not England, but we typically played a mixture of Welsh and English tunes).

Personally, I love it when a single tune is played many times: (a) it gives a chance to really develop the tune and (b) it gives more opportunity for those who don't know the tune to start to learn it. It can be frustrating to have just started to pick up the tune on the third time round only to have to leave it behind when the whole room moves on to the next tune.  ::)
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Winston Smith

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Re: Melodeon Playgroup 2020
« Reply #46 on: February 20, 2020, 10:01:05 AM »

"AABB x 3"

And there was poor Sir Jimmy (or was it one of the Wypers) getting wrong for mixing his tunes in another thread!
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Theo

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Re: Melodeon Playgroup 2020
« Reply #47 on: February 20, 2020, 10:54:00 AM »

It does depend where you are and how well the tunes are going.  Sessions I go to here in the northeast are much more flexible and its up to the person starting a set how many times to play through and indeed how many tunes to play in a set. If a tune is going well it gets played more, if nobody joins in a tune it might only get played once then move on. If a really appealing new tune crops up people will call for it to be played again the better to learn it. Sometimes the same tunes are played as a set, but often they get played in different combinations, it just depends on who started the set.  It's a musical conversation, and like any conversation listening is crucial.
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Helena Handcart

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Re: Melodeon Playgroup 2020
« Reply #48 on: February 20, 2020, 11:00:12 AM »

Sometimes the same tunes are played as a set, but often they get played in different combinations, it just depends on who started the set.  It's a musical conversation, and like any conversation listening is crucial.

Exactly this. Two As, two Bs, three times is a good rule of thumb when away from home  - in festival sessions or when visiting other areas of the country. I wouldn't necessarily stick to it at home though - especially when I am playing with friends who I regularly play with - sometimes we play them in a different way just 'cos that's the way we play them. 

I'm more careful about the two As, two Bs stuff when running a steady speed session because it is more helpful to beginner/intermediate players who are unused to sessions but in that environment three times is often not enough so four or five times through is quite usual.
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Phil B

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Re: Melodeon Playgroup 2020
« Reply #49 on: February 20, 2020, 11:14:43 AM »

"It's a musical conversation and like any conversation listening is crucial" Quote from Theo.
Could not be put any better Theo  Phil B
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Peadar

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Re: Melodeon Playgroup 2020
« Reply #50 on: February 20, 2020, 11:21:31 PM »


What I am really struggling to fix in my mind is how many bars thre are in a tune....
The dots for Dorset 4 hand give 8 bars and repeat, then a second eight bars and repeat.
As written Is the A part 8 bars or 16?

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Steve_freereeder

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Re: Melodeon Playgroup 2020
« Reply #51 on: February 21, 2020, 12:54:31 AM »

What I am really struggling to fix in my mind is how many bars thre are in a tune....

It depends how it is notated. Most traditional tunes were around and being played before they were ever written down.

Quote
The dots for Dorset 4 hand give 8 bars and repeat, then a second eight bars and repeat.
In 4/4 time, that is how it is usually notated and played.

Quote
As written Is the A part 8 bars or 16?
As written in conventional notation, the A-music has 8 bars, but these are shown as repeated (musical notation shorthand to save writing out in full), so you get 16 bars played in total. It's the number of bars played which is important, because that's how it fits the dance. The B-music has the same structure. So the Dorset Four Hand Reel*, like many other English tunes of similar structure and tempo, can be described as a 32-bar polka*.

* Let's not get into the difference between a reel and a polka. In this instance the word 'Reel' in the title of the tune has more to do with describing part of the dance steps (reel = hey, a figure-of-eight movement) than the fast, even running of notes characteristic of a Scottish or Irish reel.
« Last Edit: February 21, 2020, 08:59:29 AM by Steve_freereeder »
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Peadar

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Re: Melodeon Playgroup 2020
« Reply #52 on: February 21, 2020, 07:59:51 AM »

I am not getting a simple answer to a v simple question...at Melodeon playgroup I started Dorset 4 hand reel and then did something that breached the local way of playing the tune... Lester said AA BB or something to tht effect.

I may well have skipped the repeat of the first 8 bars but I don't know.

In this context is the A music 8 bars or 16?

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Steve_freereeder

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Re: Melodeon Playgroup 2020
« Reply #53 on: February 21, 2020, 08:23:12 AM »

I am not getting a simple answer to a v simple question...at Melodeon playgroup I started Dorset 4 hand reel and then did something that breached the local way of playing the tune... Lester said AA BB or something to tht effect.

I may well have skipped the repeat of the first 8 bars but I don't know.

In this context is the A music 8 bars or 16?
Sorry if I didn't make it clear in my previous reply. I thought I had.
The total A-music is 16 bars as played. If you look at the written music, it is normally notated as 8 bars with a repeat sign, so 2 x 8 bars = 16 bars. That is the equivalent of AA
I don't know how I can describe this any more clearly.

Video (with piano accordion, sorry!) and written music here:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4OxDwG1RfRo
« Last Edit: February 21, 2020, 09:08:41 AM by Steve_freereeder »
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malcolmbebb

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Re: Melodeon Playgroup 2020
« Reply #54 on: February 21, 2020, 08:26:20 AM »

As I recall we played the A as sixteen bars. We played those sixteen bars twice.
So the answer to your question is sixteen.

The sixteen bars, as Steve points out, is made up of eight bars with a repeat. As it happens.
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Re: Melodeon Playgroup 2020
« Reply #55 on: February 21, 2020, 08:35:25 AM »

From what's been written here, it would seem like the answer is "Whatever the 'group' decide at the time."
The confusion seems to stem from this A and B part description, which often confuses me, as it doesn't always tally with the music as it is written. Those who, primarily, play for dance don't seem to have this problem, in my experience.

Malcolm's answer endorses my view, in that the written music has a repeat, but then the whole section (which has been deemed to be the A part) including the repeat, is repeated again. Only members of a particular "group" would know that.
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Re: Melodeon Playgroup 2020
« Reply #56 on: February 21, 2020, 09:05:51 AM »

As I recall we played the A as sixteen bars. We played those sixteen bars twice...
Well, I wasn't there of course, but what you've described would give you a 32-bar A-music. That's not how it's normally played...  ???

Here's a video showing the dance and music: After an introductory A-music there are 2 x 8 = 16 bars of A-music and 2 x 8 = 16 bars of B-music.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hh0KnHYGhDU
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Re: Melodeon Playgroup 2020
« Reply #57 on: February 21, 2020, 09:11:42 AM »

It’s not difficult. If you play by yourself then you can play as many or as few repeats as you like.  If you are in a band or session, just listen to the others and play what they play.
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Re: Melodeon Playgroup 2020
« Reply #58 on: February 21, 2020, 09:12:40 AM »

Not a 32 bar A, a sixteen bar A played twice, as in AA.

But on further reflection, there were two separate sessions and I'm not sure that Peadar was in the same one as me anyway.
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Lester

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Re: Melodeon Playgroup 2020
« Reply #59 on: February 21, 2020, 10:03:10 AM »

I am not getting a simple answer to a v simple question...at Melodeon playgroup I started Dorset 4 hand reel and then did something that breached the local way of playing the tune... Lester said AA BB or something to tht effect.

I may well have skipped the repeat of the first 8 bars but I don't know.

In this context is the A music 8 bars or 16?

Ignoring repeat marks for the benefit of discussion.

From what I remember you played only the 8 bars of the WG A music whereas it is normal in English circles to play it twice to make it 16 bars in length, again with the B the tune is only 8 bars so it is normally played twice to total 16 bars thus giving a 32 bar tune.


Tune in full as normally played attached
« Last Edit: February 21, 2020, 10:07:56 AM by Lester »
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