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[Gary P Chapin]

Loïc Etienne is one of my absolute heroes. Here he is over on an AMTA video, playing a one row (first time I've seen that), and aside from the general greatness, can I get a shout out for the tapping foot?

https://lafeuilleamta.fr/2019/12/loic-etienne-marche-de-langlards?fbclid=IwAR36L-t5pNqpkNYNNWlo9B61Onu9jcxAhej_luCs6jAAMZsb3AC-whvcoSg

[Stiamh]

... can I get a shout out for the tapping foot?

I don't understand your meaning. Psst: it's feet! 

Nice clip, thanks.

[Gary P Chapin]

... can I get a shout out for the tapping foot?

I don't understand your meaning. Psst: it's feet! 

Nice clip, thanks.

It's the equivalent of saying, "can I get three cheers" for... And yes, you are right. I've seen him and both feet are always moving.

[Chris Ryall]

Loïc is a genius.  Met him as Embraud a few years ago.   

[Graham Collicutt]

Great tune and playing!

But what key is his box? and make?

Tune is D minor?  Am I hearing a low C# which isn't there?

[Kay]

Great tune and playing!

But what key is his box? and make?

Tune is D minor?  Am I hearing a low C# which isn't there?

His box is pretty new and made by Jérémie Vanglabeke.
It is possible to change the mode of the scale via the buttons behind the fingerboard.

[Graham Collicutt]

Thank you for that info. makes sense of what I am hearing.

[Gary P Chapin]

His box is pretty new and made by Jérémie Vanglabeke.
It is possible to change the mode of the scale via the buttons behind the fingerboard.

 

Mind blown. That is insane. I had no idea.

[Chris Ryall]

Celtic harp players have done this for years. Clever innovation, especially if you play with bagpipes a lot. eg Comrad play in G major or G minor.  Chavannée the same block shift in D. It isn’t convenient for their accordéonists

[Julian S]

Really enjoyed this - including the feet. So what exactly do the buttons behind the fingerboard do - change notes by a semitone ?

J

[Chris Ryall]

That's all he'd need.  The diatonic scale intervals are  TTHTTTH (tone vor halftone).  eg  C mixolydian only differs from C dorian by a half tone elevation of note 3!   

  Mixo C D E F G A Bb C   <=>  Dorian C D Eb F G A Bb C

Things are different if you are playing harmonic minor,  where there is a characteristic three  semitone interval between notes 6 and 7 in the scale 

   Harmonic minor C D Eb F G Ab B C.

But up in the Auvergne harmonic minor is "for  the birds ", the main alterations they use are 6_nat ascending,  b6 descending.  Foot stomping is very, no totally trad

Actually those clever buttons would not help Lóic in general play, but he has … technical skills to spare. One of the few Roots based musicians that I have seen use #4 in general expression of folk music

Being able to flatten notes 2,3, 6 and 7, or sharpen note 4 in diatonic music has been available on harps for …  1000 years. Amazing that nobody thought of stops to do this on melodeon is until now! Genius in my opinion   

[Anahata]

Amazing that nobody thought of stops to do this on melodeon is until now! Genius in my opinion

Well... on a harp, you can mechanically stop the existing string at the "1 semitone up" level, whereas a melodeon needs a whole new reed per voice to get the sharpened note (cf. whole extra string on the harp), so it's quite an expensive modification.

But designing a mechanism for doing it on a melodeon without leaking air must be quite clever. It's a lot more complex than a voice coupler/stop with just the one slider running the length of the reed bank.

And then if you want the basses... maybe you could use the Stradella bass concept of one reed per note (full 12 note chromatic scale)  and mechanical logic between buttons and reeds.

[Stiamh]

Amazing that nobody thought of stops to do this on melodeon is until now! Genius in my opinion

Well... on a harp, you can mechanically stop the existing string at the "1 semitone up" level, whereas a melodeon needs a whole new reed per voice to get the sharpened note (cf. whole extra string on the harp), so it's quite an expensive modification.

Not only that, but the result is clearly one exceedingly chunky one-row box - you'd surely sacrifice a lot of the agility and power of a standard one-row.

Since it has only one stop, and since I can't distinguish a piccolo voice, I assume it's a three voice MML. What is the advantage of this system over a 3v 2-row semitone box (of which there are plenty of considerably more compact models to be had)?

[Gary P Chapin]

Celtic harp players have done this for years. Clever innovation, especially if you play with bagpipes a lot. eg Comrad play in G major or G minor.  Chavannée the same block shift in D. It isn’t convenient for their accordéonists

This is a fun conversation when I play with hurdy gurdy players -- their instruments deal in parallel keys (G, Gmin, etc), while the box deals in relative keys (G, Emin, A dorian etc.)  I might be reversing that in my head. Anyway, it's good fun.

[Steve_freereeder]

Amazing that nobody thought of stops to do this on melodeon is until now! Genius in my opinion

Well... on a harp, you can mechanically stop the existing string at the "1 semitone up" level, whereas a melodeon needs a whole new reed per voice to get the sharpened note (cf. whole extra string on the harp), so it's quite an expensive modification.

But designing a mechanism for doing it on a melodeon without leaking air must be quite clever. It's a lot more complex than a voice coupler/stop with just the one slider running the length of the reed bank.

In Charles Wheatstone's patent of 1844 for improvements of the concertina, he describes a system where a moveable metal block can be made to contact the reed tongue part-way along its length, thus changing the pitch of the reed on the fly. A bit like using your finger to stop the string on a fiddle or guitar.

The patent can be seen here. The mechanism is described on page 7 (his 'fifth improvement') and also in fig.14 towards the end. I don't think this method ever achieved reliable success.

Whether the melodeon mechanism and photos described in the earlier post are something like this, I don't know.

[Anahata]

In Charles Wheatstone's patent of 1844 for improvements of the concertina, he describes a system where a moveable metal block can be made to contact the reed tongue part-way along its length, thus changing the pitch of the reed on the fly. A bit like using your finger to stop the string on a fiddle or guitar.

...or the way a harp lever works.

I thought of that possibility too, but discounted it as horribly impractical. Interesting that Wheatstone tried it though: I didn't know that.

[Dave Praties]

There exists a pitch pipe for giving a note to singers, I had one, which worked by moving a pointer across a scale marked in note values. The pointer linked to a sliding metal block such as patented by Wheatstone. They work well, but the note produced can be approximate only. Positioning such a block with the accuracy necessary to achieve correct and reproduceable tuning would necessitate some very sophisticated mechanics.

[Chris Ryall]

Sorry, I still think this is a modification of some genius, for any one playing with either Gurdies or bagpipes. Both tend to play in their drone key;  both are very good at playing major or minor … at will

The poor melodeonista is left standing with fluency in only (eg)  Am v A mixolydian on GD box. That is why so many of us lug several instruments around between festivals 

Loic generally plays with Comrad, an upbeat, very exciting group following the Auvergne tradition, and is their only  box player. 

I'd concur with .. some fairly challenging technical issues. If Jérémie Vanglabeke has solved these then he is a very competent,and very innovative maker. I would refer any doubters to the picture posted by Kay 2 days ago     

[Gena Crisman]

In Charles Wheatstone's patent of 1844 for improvements of the concertina, he describes a system where a moveable metal block can be made to contact the reed tongue part-way along its length, thus changing the pitch of the reed on the fly. A bit like using your finger to stop the string on a fiddle or guitar.

Perhaps this is a foolish question: would something like this actually sound ok? (I'm assuming the instrument in the video is actually changing between one set of reeds and another, rather than doing something like this)

I've been wondering about this as a methodology - does attempting to secure a reed higher up than its existing rivet function in any way as a tuning technique when reeds need adjusting significantly & non-destructibly upwards? (compared with, say, reed clipping)

[Steve_freereeder]

Sorry, I still think this is a modification of some genius, ...

As far as I can see, no-one is suggesting otherwise.

I'd concur with .. some fairly challenging technical issues. If Jérémie Vanglabeke has solved these then he is a very competent,and very innovative maker. I would refer any doubters to the picture posted by Kay 2 days ago 

Indeed. And once again, no-one is doubting this. However, Kay's photo leads to specualation on how it is done which is a perfectly valid question, especially for those of us who build, repair and tune instruments and therefore have an insight into their construction.