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Author Topic: Sonola/Walters  (Read 15536 times)

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Andrew Culwell

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Sonola/Walters
« on: November 18, 2009, 03:46:05 PM »

A Question for those experts out there.  When did Sonola start making Boxes for Walters NYC?  Also do we know what year Walters/Sonola stopped making boxes?  
« Last Edit: November 18, 2009, 03:59:54 PM by ajay38 »
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Hohner's, Paolo Soprani red 4 voice, Paddy Clancy Celtic

triskel

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Re: Sonola/Walters
« Reply #1 on: November 19, 2009, 02:56:22 AM »

As best I can tell, mostly in the 1960s, before Sonola was bought out in 1973.

Andrew Culwell

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Re: Sonola/Walters
« Reply #2 on: November 20, 2009, 03:48:25 PM »

Well the question is academic now.  I was bidding on a Walters which was in EBay this last week.  Someone outbid me, Curses!  Anyway it looked to be a later model maybe 40's or 50's.  I'll post picture of the one that got away.  Whoever outbid me, I  will try not to resent you  >:E
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hibbs3

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Re: Sonola/Walters
« Reply #3 on: November 21, 2009, 04:41:24 AM »

Love to see that pic, I must have missed this box on eBay :-[
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Andrew Culwell

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Re: Sonola/Walters
« Reply #4 on: November 21, 2009, 09:04:39 PM »

Yeah I irrationally thought that 1200.00 would get me the box.  It was put on by someone who thought the box it was in was the brand of accordion.  Some manufacturing firm in Connecticut called Bendini and sons or something such as that.  Anyway the box upon closer inspection on the pic said Walters NY so I bid it up to 811.00 which was high bid until someone with more money than I swooped in the last minute and bid me up to my max of 1200 then beyond.  Oh well I had promised myself not to go above that limit so I stuck to it.   Here is the pic hopefully I can attach it. I spotted it about 5 days ago and thought "what a find"  so I kept it to myself and bid.  Oh well if someone on this forum outbid me just know I was very peeved....I've gotten over it though all's fair in love and war and buying accordions. 

« Last Edit: November 21, 2009, 09:07:00 PM by ajay38 »
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HallelujahAl

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Re: Sonola/Walters
« Reply #5 on: November 21, 2009, 09:21:54 PM »

Well ajay - I'd love to be able to console you on your loss - but I'm afraid I can't. It looks like a great little box!
AL
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Andrew Culwell

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Re: Sonola/Walters
« Reply #6 on: November 21, 2009, 09:35:19 PM »

I know doesn't it....for about 48 hours I had it in my hot little hands...or so I thought.  I kept checking this forum to see if any eagle eyed M.A.D afflicted devil had found my little secret.  they obviously had but I let my common sense get the best of me.  That and the fact that I just spent a bundle converting a Corso to italian reeds with B/C tuning.  My bank account had a serious hole in it.  Doesn't it look like a wonderful little box though.  I've never seen anything like it on line!  But oh well!  The lord must have realized it wouldn't have been the prudent thing.   The one that got away!
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triskel

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Re: Sonola/Walters
« Reply #7 on: November 22, 2009, 03:51:30 AM »

Here is the pic hopefully I can attach it.

A picture tells a thousand words!

That one's not a Sonola, it was made by Baldoni Brothers (Flli. Baldoni) in Castelfidardo, in the late 1940s. It looks very similar to Baldoni, Bartoli boxes of the same vintage, and my O'Byrne de Witt Baldoni Bros.

Andrew Culwell

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Re: Sonola/Walters
« Reply #8 on: November 22, 2009, 05:16:41 AM »

I wasn't sure if it was Baldoni or Sonola but I knew it was a box that had some value. 
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hibbs3

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Re: Sonola/Walters
« Reply #9 on: November 22, 2009, 05:54:39 AM »

whoever bought it got a hell of a deal at 1200$ >:(
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boxlad

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Re: Sonola/Walters
« Reply #10 on: November 23, 2009, 04:28:23 PM »

Hi Ajay,
I purchased that box and am awaiting delivery at the moment. It's not very often that a Walters shows up on e-bay but it looks to be in great shape and I am hoping it is just as sound internally. I will let you know how it is. I'll post a few more pics when it arrives.
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pgroff

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Re: Sonola/Walters
« Reply #11 on: November 23, 2009, 07:57:33 PM »

Congratulations boxlad!

It does look in nice shape. I saw that and wanted it for a buddy of mine but our budget was tight and we reckoned our bid would be too low.

Looks to be a real musician's box -- great quality and few of the frills. Black is classy in an accordion IMO.

I have seen ones very much like your new one with the reeds set up in LMMH, but more often in LLMM or LMMM. Usually this model seems to be 4 voice, but they may have crammed 6 sets in there. Will be interesting to know how yours is set up, if you want to share that. If it is still in original tuning it might be in A 443, 445, or even as high as 447 (on average of the melody reeds and the basses).

Enjoy it in good health.... I think it's great that some of these boxes commissioned by Irish-Americans and made in Italy are making the trip back across the Atlantic, 50 years later or more.

PG
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Lars

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Re: Sonola/Walters
« Reply #12 on: November 23, 2009, 09:31:13 PM »

It's very identical to Stephen's red OBDW, but it's also a lot like Charlie Harris' old 19 key Baldoni-Bartoli (green / white) and my 10 key 6 voice Baldoni-Bartoli.

Lovely size box - really easy to handle, even at high volumes and speeds. My fav. has to be Charlie's LMMM - he did some recording for Shaskeen on this box (Music for set dancing and listening Vol. 3 really brings out the sound of this box!) but has since replaced the treble mechanism with that of an old Paolo Soprani. The problem being the original not closing tight enough. Some strange system of levers getting worn down... My box was rebuild to avoid this. Would be interesting to see how it it on this Walters.

//Lars

(yes, I wanted it too!:))
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pgroff

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Re: Sonola/Walters
« Reply #13 on: November 23, 2009, 11:09:31 PM »

Lars,

I think they must have been experimenting with different mechanisms in these, or else the cases were imported without mechanisms sometimes and those were installed in NY, or else some mechanisms were replaced early on. The reason I say this is that I have seen 4 or 5 different kinds of mechanisms in these, none of which looked to have been installed recently.

PG
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boxlad

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Re: Sonola/Walters
« Reply #14 on: November 24, 2009, 09:34:57 AM »

Quote
I have seen ones very much like your new one with the reeds set up in LMMH, but more often in LLMM or LMMM. Usually this model seems to be 4 voice, but they may have crammed 6 sets in there. Will be interesting to know how yours is set up, if you want to share that.

Hi Paul,
I would be delighted to share this information when I get my hands on the box. It's interesting to consider the many variations in construction and voices that these boxes had. I'm thinking it's a four voice but you suggested it might be a six voice which surprised me! Anyway, we will know soon and I will post more pictures internally and externally of the box in the coming days and would love to hear your thoughts on any aspect of it. 
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Lars

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Re: Sonola/Walters
« Reply #15 on: November 24, 2009, 04:40:06 PM »

... but you suggested it might be a six voice which surprised me!

I've only ever heard of one six voice box with two full rows - belongs to an old chap in the west of Ireland as far as I've been told - and it's supposed to be HUGE! I'll bet you a pint that this is a 4 voice.

Paul: I've yet to see an original! All those I've seen has been rebuild recently, so I have nothing to build this on, other than what Anders and Charlie has told me / showed me. Much can be done with a bit of tinkering - considering the exeptional exterior condition of the Walters in question.
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pgroff

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Re: Sonola/Walters
« Reply #16 on: November 24, 2009, 06:00:06 PM »

Lars,

I agree that this black Walters is most likely 4 voice, but I've seen some 6 voice 19 key D/C#s (and 8 voice ones) with the rounded body shape that are about the same size as this one of boxlad's. For this body size, that would be 6 narrow reed blocks for two rows of pallets! Sometimes they really crammed the reeds in there. I wish I had pics of some of the interesting ones I saw over the years.

Some of the earlier round-bodied Baldoni-Bartolis and even some early square-bodied Walters had 19 pallets all in one row, 3 long reedblocks for 6 voices. But as you suggest, those are a bigger (taller) body size than boxlad's black one.

PG


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Lars

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Re: Sonola/Walters
« Reply #17 on: November 24, 2009, 09:59:15 PM »

I agree that this black Walters is most likely 4 voice, but I've seen some 6 voice 19 key D/C#s (and 8 voice ones) with the rounded body shape that are about the same size as this one of boxlad's. For this body size, that would be 6 narrow reed blocks for two rows of pallets! Sometimes they really crammed the reeds in there. I wish I had pics of some of the interesting ones I saw over the years.

Some of the earlier round-bodied Baldoni-Bartolis and even some early square-bodied Walters had 19 pallets all in one row, 3 long reedblocks for 6 voices. But as you suggest, those are a bigger (taller) body size than boxlad's black one.
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Andrew Culwell

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Re: Sonola/Walters
« Reply #18 on: November 24, 2009, 11:12:55 PM »

Hi Ajay,
I purchased that box and am awaiting delivery at the moment. It's not very often that a Walters shows up on e-bay but it looks to be in great shape and I am hoping it is just as sound internally. I will let you know how it is. I'll post a few more pics when it arrives.

Well I figured it was someone on this forum who got it.  I'm Jealous.  However I probably would have turned right around and shopped it to this forum in trade or barter for a Paolo or something.  As I don't play the tuning it's in.  I just saw it and thought that no one else had....boy was I deluded!  Glad you got it though (he said grudgingly)    ;D  The guy said it belonged to his father in law didnt know much about it's history but it looks to be in fantastic shape.  Your fortunate that I didn't bid it any higher at one point I thought I'd go as high as 2K but damned common sense took hold!
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pgroff

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Re: Sonola/Walters
« Reply #19 on: November 24, 2009, 11:16:47 PM »

Lars,

In this photo you can see most of a "tall" early rounded Baldoni Bartoli, with 6 voices and 19 pallets in a single row. It's a big box but moves pretty well. Also as you would expect the timbre is the same - nice and crisp - from both rows, not muted on the inside row as in some of the rounded Baldonis with 2 rows of pallets.

The players are my buddies Hugh O'Rourke (red Baldoni), Jack Conroy (Jr. Martin custom melodeon, not his usual Walters) and me (Madden 1 row Walters).

PG
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