Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[Ruaraidh]

Hi,

Can you suggest some (preferably scottish pipe) tunes that are good for a beginner? I am interested to know which keys they come out well on a BC box (BCC# in fact, but lets not get over optimistic at this stage), with regards to pushing and pulling. For example, the way I worked out to play "Road to the Isles" was nearly all on the pull, and I am running out of arm!

Thanks a lot!

Ruaraidh

[george garside]

road to isles probably easiest in key of G  starting on note D.  If playing in A the ever outwards bellows can be avaoided by using the push W on c row and push B on B row. Getting the hang of using these 2 notes on push wherever possible ( ;but not always!) is fundemental to playing in A  . Always try to find ways of fingering that prevent large bellows opening if possible

george

[graememackay]

Ruaraidh

You will probably already know a lot of pipe tunes in your head anyway, so keep it simple but it might be best to learn them in A and D as god intended.  This will help you learn these keys which are probably the keys that will cause the most effort in the learning process.

Try Father John Macmillan of Barra, Lord Lovats Lament & Dovecot park.  3 very different tunes as far as rythm goes & will give you a good excersise at the button & bellow end too.

[Mike Averill]

If they are pipe tunes learn them in Bb and Eb if you have any intention of actually playing with pipers. They may write their music in A and D but the chanters are pitched sharp.

[george garside]

This iis of course where the BCC#  has a huge advantage over other types of push/pull boxes. What you have learned in A on the outside rows becomes Bflat when played on the inside rows, similarly D self transposes into E flat - beat that for a freeby!

george

[Ruaraidh]

If they are pipe tunes learn them in Bb and Eb if you have any intention of actually playing with pipers. They may write their music in A and D but the chanters are pitched sharp.

I may play with pipers as I know a couple here, though it would be hard for me to accompany myself on both instruments; of course not only is the pipe chanter higher pitched, but the pipes  also produce 100dB....

Thanks for the suggestions. Father John Macmillan is one of my favourite tunes on the pipes, but I'll need to get up a little bit more speed on the box for that (definitely still on the slow airs - Do you know Mairi Bhan Og, Al? A beautiful slow air from the piping repertoire).

Ruaraidh

[Ruaraidh]

This iis of course where the BCC#  has a huge advantage over other types of push/pull boxes. What you have learned in A on the outside rows becomes Bflat when played on the inside rows, similarly D self transposes into E flat - beat that for a freeby!

george

That is really good news in case I do end up playing with the pipes! (Knowing myself, it's hard not to play the pipes though, when others are...)

How do you answer several messages in one? I've seen others do it here...

Ruaraidh

[Bill Young]

How do you answer several messages in one? I've seen others do it here...

Ruaraidh

Ruaraidh,
When you start to reply, you'll find all the previous posts appear in a "Topic Summary" below the box you're typing in. Each previous message has an "Insert Quote" in its top right corner. Click on that and it'll go into the reply box where the cursor is. So you can quote and reply several times in the one message. Like this:

Do you know Mairi Bhan Og, Al? A beautiful slow air from the piping repertoire).

Ruaraidh

Not yet, but I'm just going to look it up.
Bill

[HallelujahAl]

Do you know Mairi Bhan Og, Al? A beautiful slow air from the piping repertoire).

Ruaraidh

Not yet, but I'm just going to look it up.
Bill

Let us know when you find it Bill!
 

[nemethmik]

If they are pipe tunes learn them in Bb and Eb if you have any intention of actually playing with pipers.

I may play with pipers as I know a couple here, though it would be hard for me to accompany myself on both instruments; of course not only is the pipe chanter higher pitched

I am a piper; the good news is that there are so many kinds of Scottish pipes. I am sure Ruaraidh does not want to play along with the Great Highland Bagpipe (GHB). A GHB normally is pitched much sharper than concert pitched Bb. That is, a GHB does (never) not sound in Bb. There are some concert pitched Bb or A GHB chanters, but they are (very) rare.
However, Scottish Smalpipes (SSP) are available in concert pitched A, Bb, C and D.
Border Pipes (BP) are normally available in A. The mouth blown 3/4 pipes are normally available in A and concert pitch Bb. I have and play all of these kinds of pipes.
Far the most popular pitch of SSP and BP is A, that is, you'd best learn all your tunes in A or D, exactly the way the music is written for the pipers; exacltly as Graeme Mackay recommended above.
I regularly play my pipes (SSP, BP, 3/4) in A with a Scottish Ceili band with an accordion player.
I hope this helps.
Miki

[Ruaraidh]

A GHB normally is pitched much sharper than concert pitched Bb. That is, a GHB does (never) not sound in Bb. There are some concert pitched Bb or A GHB chanters, but they are (very) rare.
However, Scottish Smalpipes (SSP) are available in concert pitched A, Bb, C and D.
Border Pipes (BP) are normally available in A. The mouth blown 3/4 pipes are normally available in A and concert pitch Bb. I have and play all of these kinds of pipes.
Far the most popular pitch of SSP and BP is A, that is, you'd best learn all your tunes in A or D, exactly the way the music is written for the pipers; exacltly as Graeme Mackay recommended above.
I regularly play my pipes (SSP, BP, 3/4) in A with a Scottish Ceili band with an accordion player.
I hope this helps.
Miki

Thanks!

Both my GH pipes are pretty much Bb (a little sharper), though obviously I only think in terms of A. My smallpipes are A=440.

Basically I have learn the scale for the key of A on the box, and then I'll be away, bearing in mind George's advice on the push B and E...

Do you know Mairi Bhan Og, Al? A beautiful slow air from the piping repertoire).

Ruaraidh

Not yet, but I'm just going to look it up.
Bill

Let us know when you find it Bill!
 

I sent Mairi Bhan Og to you Bill, and Al.

Ruaraidh

[nemethmik]

Both my GH pipes are pretty much Bb (a little sharper)

Wow! You did not tell that you are a piper, too. I could have saved my previous reply 
In the band I played last the pipe major's chanter was around 480.

[Bill Young]

I sent Mairi Bhan Og to you Bill, and Al.

Ruaraidh

Thanks for that, Ruaraidh. I think that version (in Bm) from the Scots Guards book is the definitive one. I found one in Dm in one of the fiddle books. It's a bit low, and a bit different, but has some chords which could be suitable when transcribed to Bm.

I also found a nice midi file of the tune. For some reason, we can't attach .mid files on this forum, so here's the link: http://www.contemplator.com/midimusic/maribhan.mid

Bill

[graememackay]

I regularly play with Highland pipers all the time.  Occasionally the pipes are out, but we get together before the performance to tweak them before we start so they are as close as they can get.  I know there are a lot of die hard pipers withThe beauty of the 3 voice scottish musette is that it can usually capture any mis-tunings within the tremolo and sounds grand.

As for playing in Bb it's as simple as moving to the inside row and playing the tunes as normal, just as George says.

[Ruaraidh]

I maybe getting ahead of myself here, but obviously on the pipes you have gracenotes all over the place, and in patterns which would not easily be played on the box. So for example, between the two initial Bs in "Mist covered mountains" I would play low g, d, low g, e gracenotes on the pipes. What sort of ornamentation sounds right on the box? There is a bit of info about it in the book, "the box"... Or should I be worrying first about adding simple bass before this?

[george garside]

my advice would be to keep things as simple as possible to begin with (and 'to begin with' can last as long as you see fit!).  Ornementations (basics in 'the box' ) should be learned as a separate exercise  outside of tunes and then can be sprinkled sparingly as & when required but not overdone). again the amount & type of ornementation used, if at all, in a particular tune is entirely down to the feelings & ability of the playr but MUST enhance the tune rather than turn it into a jumble of notes,

The ornementations you may find fairly easy on the box will not usually exactly replicate those you would use on the pipes  but can be used to convey a pipey   'atmosphere' to the music.   You will of course, as a piper, be in an ideal position to get th phrasing right & I personally think that a tune played simply but with great phrasing, dynamics & rhythm isounds far nicer than one totally cluttered with unnecesary odds & sods just to prove how fast the player can twiddle!

george

[Bill Young]

I maybe getting ahead of myself here, but obviously on the pipes you have gracenotes all over the place, and in patterns which would not easily be played on the box. So for example, between the two initial Bs in "Mist covered mountains" I would play low g, d, low g, e gracenotes on the pipes. What sort of ornamentation sounds right on the box? There is a bit of info about it in the book, "the box"... Or should I be worrying first about adding simple bass before this?

Ruaraidh, there's very little, or none, of the Irish-style ornamentation used in Scottish music on the box, so I'd leave that bit of "The Box" book in abeyance for the time being at least. As for pipe grace notes, one of the reasons for having them doesn't apply on the box - separating two notes of the same tone. You can play the two Bs separately on the accordion. It's possible to miss out all of the grace notes in the pipe version of the tune, and it'll still sound all right; especially if you play a bass accompaniment.
 I presume you're playing the tune from the Scots Guards book (in Bm). Instead of the taorluath before the second B, you could a) do nothing; b) play one or two very short Bs; c) play a very short (cut) C#; d) play a very short (cut) A. If you try a simple bass (B-Bm-Bm for each B in the treble), grace notes are largely unnecessary.
I have this tune in Am, with chords, which you could transpose up a tone to Bm.

[Ruaraidh]

I personally think that a tune played simply but with great phrasing, dynamics & rhythm isounds far nicer than one totally cluttered with unnecesary odds & sods just to prove how fast the player can twiddle!

Agreed! Thanks George, I'll keep it simple 

I presume you're playing the tune from the Scots Guards book (in Bm). Instead of the taorluath before the second B, you could a) do nothing; b) play one or two very short Bs; c) play a very short (cut) C#; d) play a very short (cut) A. If you try a simple bass (B-Bm-Bm for each B in the treble), grace notes are largely unnecessary.
I have this tune in Am, with chords, which you could transpose up a tone to Bm.

Thanks Bill. Yes, I am trying to play it in Bm. I have tried the short A route, as I had realised that nothing like a taorluath was going to happen, or sound good. I also tried either one of the dotted Bs as a triplet with A or C, which gives it the trebling feeling of a taorluath without trying to do anything fast.

Ruaraidh