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[John C]

I'm feeling a bit aimless and need some direction!

When I play/practice I play from music and go through a book(s) playing one tune after the other.   I know I'm making some progress but I'm not particularly fluent with any particular tune.

I'm not good at memorizing tunes and don't feel I can start at this stage in my life.

Are you playing tunes in general and trusting that one day "the light goes on" and you become fluent with some of the pieces - OR are you hammering away at the same tune time and time again until its burnt into your brain and fingers - which is something I find difficult to do.

I have included playing scales in my practice and I don't find that boring

Any feedback would be appreciated

[michik]

First ... I am listening _actively_ to quite a lot of music, which I'm playing ...
that helps to get an idea about how the tunes are played (rythm, dynamics, groove...)

When I start learning a tune, first I try to learn the melody (treble side only) slowly, neglecting regular rythm and pace.
In a second step I add the basses. If the bases are known, before I reverse these two steps sometimes.

Important: Avoid mistakes. If you do the same mistake again, reduce speed.  
For the brain there is no right or wrong, the brain learns only that, what are you repeat again and again, even if it is 'wrong'.

In a third step I try to keep rythm/speed/groove, with counting the bars, sometimes using a metronome.
Learn to count (1-2-3 or 1-and-2-and-3-and, ...) while playing, this helps quite a lot.
And learn to use your feet ... they are like a percussion instrument.

When the tune work quite well, I try to speed up the whole thing.

In the first time I'm using sheet music, but later I'll try it without it.

This is working quite well for me.

[Bob Ellis]

When I play/practice I play from music and go through a book(s) playing one tune after the other.   I know I'm making some progress but I'm not particularly fluent with any particular tune. I'm not good at memorizing tunes and don't feel I can start at this stage in my life.

The problem might be that you are merely playing from the music. I play most tunes from the sheet music initially, but I then learn them so that I can play them without the sheet music. While I am playing a tune from the sheet music, I am concentrating on reading the music, so I am playing the notes of the tune but nothing more; when I can play the tune from memory, I begin to go beyond the notes and start playing the music because I can concentrate on the subtle nuances of expression and tone that give the tune life and interest.

I suspect that you are doing yourself a disservice by assuming that you cannot memorize tunes: it is simply a matter of repeating a tune a sufficient number of times until it sinks down into your soul. Humming it to yourself when you are doing other things helps. John Kirkpatrick recommends playing the same tune over and over again because only then do you begin to appreciate its full potential. I think that he is absolutely right.

Like most things, memorizing tunes is difficult at first, but it becomes progressively easier the more you work at it. While it is undoubtedly harder to memorize tunes later in life than earlier, it is not as difficult as it appears at first. I didn't start playing until I was in my 50s and two friends of mine were in their mid-60s when they began playing and both are able to memorise quite a large repertoire of tunes.

[nfldbox]

As to memorizing tunes, I have been playing one musical instrument or another all my life and I am now 59. I don't find it any more difficult now than before.
I agree that you should go off book as quickly as possible. It is not just that you hear the music differently: your relationship with your playing changes. I find I can start thinking of rolls, crossovers, slides a very different way when I am not reading. You should check things periodically, though. I have been known to embed mistakes and not find out for a couple of weeks.
I think you need to choose one or two pieces and work at them, rather than just wander around. For me the best approach has always been to choose a piece that obsesses me for one reason or another. Music for a Found Harmonium had that effect on me. If you really need that piece to be under your fingers, the practising is a lot easier.
If you sightread well, though, wandering through a book and picking up tunes that are worth learning can be great. I find a traipse through something like one of the O'Neill books can lead me to pieces I have never heard.
And otherwise, follow the above, especially Michik: very good advice.

[Keithypete.]

I often practice a tune to death. Keep going over bits again and again, break it right down, slow it right down 'til it either goes right or I get fed up with it. Then I rest it for a couple of hours or a couple of days. When I go back to it after the elapsed time I am invariably surprised at how much has stuck or sunk in. I feel that I 'know' a tune well enough to play on the 'box when I can whistle it right through confidently, when I'm learning by lug 'ole, that is.
   You only really know if you are doing any good when you take your party piece out to a session or similar, and try playing with other people - at their speed, or their version of the tune is a little bit different. Keep plugging away.

[michik]

Another important issue: breaks !
practise for 15-20minutes, have a 5min break, practise for another 15-20min
try to conclude a practise block positively so that you start the break with a feeling of success.

[Steve C.]

I think that many of us only try to learn tunes that we already like: ones from TOTM, from YouTube, etc.  Once you have heard it played, often by someone inspiring (current fave: DTN) then, go find the dots or ABC and start to learn the tune.  You already know where you are heading, you already have some idea of how to tell when you are there. Going through tune books, tune by tune, not too good use of energy.  Only exception, in my case, was Mally's first book.  Really worth the time to learn a lot of good, basic techniques.

[John C]

This really is a great site - many thanks for the responses and information.

I find the suggestions very helpful and positive.   Its really interesting to hear how others learn and I appreciate your helpful words.

John

[ladydetemps]

This thread might have some useful tips too
http://forum.melodeon.net/index.php/topic,1614.0.html

My 'practice' has changed since I first started. I used to play scales then work on 1 to 2 tunes for weeks at a time (1 hour a day minimum).
Now I do scales then 3 tunes one new, one old and one I just feel like playing. Played to fit in the hour. And every so often I just pick a technique to work on for 90% of the practice.

[joe]

I thought practice referred to GP surgeries, and practise to all things learning related ....

I agree with the concept of playing tunes that you have heard and want to learn. I have no desire to learn from dots a tune that I have never heard, seems pointless to me. Also the method I use pushes the boundaries a little bit each time I learn a tune, whether it be new notes, new runs or new keys! Without this reason to learn a tune I usually cant be bothered (and therefore I go through stages of very little practise). Because I only play stuff I enjoy, I never get bored, and it never becomes a chore. I never start tunes in a session unless I want to play those tunes, and I think this has a positive impact on how I sound.

[michik]

I'm really really really not a grammar/punctuation pedant, but in case anyone wants to follow the 'correct' UK usage, practice is the noun and practise is the verb. One way of remembering is by comparison with advice and advise, although without the benefit of the pronunciation difference.

Thanks for the remark. I'm not a native English speaker/writer so I unwittingly ignore such 'little' differences sometimes. 
Actually I thought 'practice' = American English, 'practise' = British English.

[Stiamh]

Well I certainly can be a grammar pedant when the mood takes me but it's a thankless role to play in general and mostly not worth the effort in internet forums - at least that's how I feel about it.

But since the point has been raised, in the present case, Michi, the first half of your understanding of the situation is correct. American spelling is always with a "c", but as jb points out, British spelling distinguishes between the verb and the noun.

Canadian spelling is in theory mostly British-with-exceptions, but in practice most people cleave more closely to American usage. I make this point because John is a neighbour of mine in Montreal and so his use of the verb with a "c" is acceptable.

Anyway, John, to get back on topic, here's another suggestion: join a class of learners who are at your level and feed off the group's energy to stimulate yourself to memorize tunes. I happen to know of one not terribly far from you... 

[Peter G]

So a British doctor (etc.) has a licence to practise and an American has a license to practice! Neat eh?  is there thred drift too? 

[nfldbox]

First: I always use "practise" as the verb and every spellcheck--including this one--doesn't like it. When I publish anything in the USA and all too often in Canada it becomes practice. (spellcheck liked that one)
But if you want to be a grammar pedant go after the cardinal sins: principle/principal and its/it's.
Back to what was the thread:
when I started the BC I was told to work on some simple pieces but I found those boring immediately. So I decided to take three of my favourites from playing other instruments: Smash the Windows, Haste to the Wedding and the Bucks of Oranmore. All were very difficult for me, especially the last, but they were pieces I wanted and so I beat them to death. And eventually I could play them, albeit slowly.
I think the best motivation to practise--or practice--and the best method is ultimately how much you want that tune.

[stevejay]

Note to self: Play a little everyday, but don't call it practice. Lately work has consumed me, I forgot I owned two melodeons. 

Too late now, neighbors in nearby apartments, oh...well...

[michik]

I even play at 2 a.m. ... I live in an appartment house ... nobody complained about it upto now ...
It's a 100 year old building with 50cm walls.

[Alison Scott]

When I play/practice I play from music and go through a book(s) playing one tune after the other.   I know I'm making some progress but I'm not particularly fluent with any particular tune.

I notice this a bit; there are now some hundreds of tunes that I can join in with to some extent when other people start them, but the number I feel personally confident with (and by 'confident' I mean 'happy to play as the only melody instrument in front of 50 people at the folk club) remains very small.

I'm not good at memorizing tunes and don't feel I can start at this stage in my life.

It's not really about memorising; that's a misapprehension based on working with books.

Best is to find some friends, have them play some tunes, and join in. Start by playing the last note of every phrase because that's easy, and gradually fill in the other bits as the tune goes round and round. Play the same tune several times through once a week for several months and you will know it without knowing how you learnt it. You still might not be able to play it straight off on your own (that takes much longer), but if someone else starts it you can join in.

But not everyone has handy local friends for this. In which case you can simulate the same experience with teaching CDs that are designed to do the same thing. Pick a tune, set it on repeat on your CD player or MP3 player, and play it six times through.  A day or two later, do it again. As above, don't worry if you can only catch tiny bits of phrases or even none at all at first, it all comes in time. Start with your favourite tunes.

[Chris Brimley]

I agree with you, Alison.  John, it seems to me that what you are looking mainly for is a reason for practising, and the best way of getting one is to set yourself a goal - go and play at a session or a folk club, or something, of you don't already, and prepare some tunes to play.  If you already do that, set yourself a higher goal - a bigger folk club or something, and work out a really good set of tunes to play - preferably a different set from what others play, just because they're different. 

[george garside]

There seems to be more emphasis (by some but not all) ib 'pracicing tunes' rather than practicing instrumental technique.  The latter is much more important & is for most of us a life long developmental experience.  Thre is always room to do a bit of fine honing to instrumental technique & to pinch bits of it from other players to work on.

Practicing tunes  is ,for many, more like tune hopping - ' Ive  practiced that one  for an hour or two - roll on the next one!' type of thing.  The result is unfortunately often an ever increasing repertoire of tunes that vary from crappy to ok.  Practice the box & new tunes can start at the ok level  & be honed to muich higher levels, as can levels of satisfaction. The starting at 'crappy level' can then be largely avoided.

Difficullt bits of technique eg fast runs as in harvest home , 3 finger triplets, improved fine bellow control & using bellows to provide an underlying rhythm etc etc etc can all be practiced as single techniques outside of a tune & once mastered can be inserted easlily in any tune where they are likely to make it sound better & lbe left alone when they don't.


It is then possible to go back to qwll the tunes that have been 'learned'  whether by ear of from the dots & start to play them musically!

george

[Alison Scott]

Difficullt bits of technique eg fast runs as in harvest home , 3 finger triplets, improved fine bellow control & using bellows to provide an underlying rhythm etc etc etc can all be practiced as single techniques outside of a tune & once mastered can be inserted easlily in any tune where they are likely to make it sound better & lbe left alone when they don't.

You are right of course. Perhaps 2010 should be my year of the three finger triplet.