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Author Topic: German Melodeon Library - Elementary School for Diatonic Accordions  (Read 7365 times)

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Mike Averill

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Re: German Melodeon Library - Elementary School for Diatonic Accordions
« Reply #20 on: March 17, 2010, 03:11:01 PM »

Finally had chance to explore the pile of music that came with my Club X. It is all scores rather than tutorial and appears to be all in this 'Seifert' Notation rather than proper music. The book "Wanderlust" is dated 1935, contains 130 tunes, and appears to be aimed at the youngster marching through the hills with their Hohner Lilliputs in there knapsacks. It includes a two page summary of the notation shown bellow.
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OwenG

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Re: German Melodeon Library - Elementary School for Diatonic Accordions
« Reply #21 on: March 17, 2010, 03:40:51 PM »

If it's a Liliput on the cover, the lad must be really really small! ;D
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nemethmik

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Re: German Melodeon Library - Elementary School for Diatonic Accordions
« Reply #22 on: April 28, 2010, 12:03:03 PM »

http://www.treewind.co.uk/melnet/DHB-Elementarschule.pdf
http://www.treewind.co.uk/melnet/DHS-Kutschenreuter.pdf
http://www.treewind.co.uk/melnet/1x1-Handharmonika.pdf
http://forum.melodeon.net/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=3516.0;attach=2765;image

There is a very important plus in all of these tutor booklets: half of the contents of each are about multi-voice (two or three buttons pressed at a time) playing. The tutor books/videos (I have) for English melodeon or Irish B/C button accordion have no sections about multi-voice playing.

 
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Willh

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Re: German Melodeon Library - Elementary School for Diatonic Accordions
« Reply #23 on: August 19, 2017, 08:24:20 PM »

So, is it possible to still get music written in the Seifert system for Club boxes?

If so, doesn't anyone have a link? I'm new to Club/melodeons and I'm rather enjoying the 1x1-Handharmonika.pdf.

It seems to be a very comfortable system that is easy for me to follow.

Thanks,

Will
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Will

Sebastian

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Re: German Melodeon Library - Elementary School for Diatonic Accordions
« Reply #24 on: August 19, 2017, 08:59:58 PM »

So, is it possible to still get music written in the Seifert system for Club boxes?
First of all, I am not really a fan of tab notation, to put it mildly, for a bunch of reasons, and I would not recommend it. But there are already other threads dedicated to that subject.

The only tab notation today still in use for Club accordion is Griffschrift. That's the term you may want to google. Mr. Fuchs has a very short history of tab notation for diatonic accordion (Club & Steirische).
« Last Edit: August 19, 2017, 09:06:19 PM by Sebastian »
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TomBom

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Re: German Melodeon Library - Elementary School for Diatonic Accordions
« Reply #25 on: August 19, 2017, 09:06:43 PM »

Will, I don't think so. Unless you have access to German second hand bookshops. Or some old accordion shop. Amazing you like these kind of notation. My local library (Southern Germany) still has some books for diatonic accordions. Every single one uses a different kind of Griffschrift. I hate that. IMO it would be best to switch to standard notation ASAP.

BTW you can have a look at http://www.ggms.nl/Clubmodel.html - there are pdf and soundfiles for club boxes. Button numbers start with 1.
A quick search on amazon.de for "Curt Mahr Handharmonika" turns up a few books, too.
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TomBom

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Re: German Melodeon Library - Elementary School for Diatonic Accordions
« Reply #26 on: August 19, 2017, 09:15:48 PM »

The only tab notation today still in use for Club accordion is Griffschrift. That's the term you may want to google. Mr. Fuchs has a very short history of tab notation for diatonic accordion (Club & Steirische).
You'd have to be careful then. Recent books are written for 4 row steirisch boxes. Usually a few tunes can be played on 3 row steirisch boxes.
So most likely you'd have to adapt them. But why? I'd rather prefer these old books from the 50s and 60s.
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Willh

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Re: German Melodeon Library - Elementary School for Diatonic Accordions
« Reply #27 on: August 20, 2017, 08:36:18 AM »

Finally had chance to explore the pile of music that came with my Club X. It is all scores rather than tutorial and appears to be all in this 'Seifert' Notation rather than proper music. The book "Wanderlust" is dated 1935, contains 130 tunes, and appears to be aimed at the youngster marching through the hills with their Hohner Lilliputs in there knapsacks. It includes a two page summary of the notation shown bellow.

Hi Mike,

Any chance I could persuade you to do a scan of the "Wanderlust" book?

Looks like it could have some interesting tunes in it.

Will
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Will

Willh

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Re: German Melodeon Library - Elementary School for Diatonic Accordions
« Reply #28 on: August 20, 2017, 08:44:12 AM »

Will, I don't think so. Unless you have access to German second hand bookshops. Or some old accordion shop. Amazing you like these kind of notation. My local library (Southern Germany) still has some books for diatonic accordions. Every single one uses a different kind of Griffschrift. I hate that. IMO it would be best to switch to standard notation ASAP.

BTW you can have a look at http://www.ggms.nl/Clubmodel.html - there are pdf and soundfiles for club boxes. Button numbers start with 1.
A quick search on amazon.de for "Curt Mahr Handharmonika" turns up a few books, too.

I'm using both Seifert (well, the only stuff I have is in the PDF posted here) and standard notation.

The thing I like about the Seifert system is that it's unambiguous. Notes on the line are on the F row and notes off the line (between lines) are on the C row. I've been trying to notate some ABC files so I can re-reference tricky passages. Trying to decide on fingerings, then looking up which actual notes they represent (I'm still learning all the notes, push and pull) to then adding this to the ABC file is a real pain.

I've googled Seifert and Mahr and have found the following, but it doesn't seem to be available (note this is both volumes 1 and 2):

http://www.musik-direkt.com/Das-neue-1x1-der-Handharmonika-Band-2-gruendlicher-Lehrgang-fuer-das-Handharmonikaspiel_px172888de.html

Does anyone here by any chance have a PDF of volume 2? Then I'd have both of the Mahr method books and quite a few tunes. :)

Will
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Sebastian

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Re: German Melodeon Library - Elementary School for Diatonic Accordions
« Reply #29 on: August 20, 2017, 09:12:28 AM »

Notes on the line are on the F row and notes off the line (between lines) are on the C row.

Griffschrift. That's the term you may want to google. Mr. Fuchs has a very short history of tab notation for diatonic accordion (Club & Steirische).
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Willh

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Re: German Melodeon Library - Elementary School for Diatonic Accordions
« Reply #31 on: August 20, 2017, 11:26:07 AM »

Notes on the line are on the F row and notes off the line (between lines) are on the C row.

Griffschrift. That's the term you may want to google. Mr. Fuchs has a very short history of tab notation for diatonic accordion (Club & Steirische).

Thanks, but this seems to deal with the Steirisches system, which I did have a look at, but ultimately would require me to do a certain amount of decoding to get value from it.

But I appreciate you pointing it out.

Will
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Sebastian

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Re: German Melodeon Library - Elementary School for Diatonic Accordions
« Reply #32 on: August 20, 2017, 11:47:19 AM »

Thanks, but this seems to deal with the Steirisches system
The system is the same. You will find a Seifert example in the article.
« Last Edit: August 20, 2017, 11:51:44 AM by Sebastian »
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Willh

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Re: German Melodeon Library - Elementary School for Diatonic Accordions
« Reply #33 on: August 20, 2017, 11:57:59 AM »

It's available for about  ₤10 via German amazon:
https://www.amazon.de/gp/offer-listing/0203907159/ref=dp_olp_used?ie=UTF8&condition=used

Wanderlust:
https://www.amazon.de/gp/offer-listing/B006XG38DG/ref=dp_olp_used?ie=UTF8&condition=used

Thanks, Tom. I'm ordering them now. :D

Vielen Dank in die Runde und ich wünsche Euch einen schönen Tag noch!

Will
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Willh

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Re: German Melodeon Library - Elementary School for Diatonic Accordions
« Reply #34 on: August 20, 2017, 11:59:56 AM »

Thanks, but this seems to deal with the Steirisches system
The system is the same. You will find a Seifert example in the article.

Fair enough. I'll go back and have another gander, then.

Will
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Sebastian

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Re: German Melodeon Library - Elementary School for Diatonic Accordions
« Reply #35 on: August 20, 2017, 11:43:09 PM »

Here is another example, somewhat newer (1958), from "Seifert’s Handharmonika-Musik". The system used is normal Griffschrift.
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Willh

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Re: German Melodeon Library - Elementary School for Diatonic Accordions
« Reply #36 on: August 21, 2017, 07:53:45 AM »

Here is another example, somewhat newer (1958), from "Seifert’s Handharmonika-Musik". The system used is normal Griffschrift.

Does "normal Griffschrift" mean the Steirisches System / Holzschuh / Seifert?
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Will

Sebastian

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Re: German Melodeon Library - Elementary School for Diatonic Accordions
« Reply #37 on: August 21, 2017, 04:33:20 PM »

Does "normal Griffschrift" mean the Steirisches System / Holzschuh / Seifert?
Sorry, I didn't make it clear enough.

Griffschrift means a tab notation which looks more or less like normal musical notation. The note heads between the lines indicate the buttons on the outer diatonic row of a diatonic accordion, the note heads on the lines indicate the buttons on the next inner diatonic row. This notation for the two outer rows is commono to all variations of Griffschrift.

The following inner rows (one row on Club and one [but with different note layout] to three rows on Steirische) are indicated by #s before the note heads or square note heads or something like this. Here appears a difference between the notation for a Club box and for a Steirische (even if only a three-row Steirische). The indication for the two outer rows remains the same for all types of boxes. (Another difference is, of course, the notation of the basses.)

Griffschrift for the Steirische Harmonika didn't exist prior to 1975 (and even than only for three-row Steirische). So you are safe with older editions. Anyway, I wouldn't suppose many new publikations for Club after 1975.

The edition in question is from the 50s and indikates "Handharmonika" (a term used for Club). (It even shows a Club box on the title page) Publications for Steirische Harmonika tend to use the term "Steirische", because it was (more or less) a new type of melodeon emerging in the 1970s.
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Willh

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Re: German Melodeon Library - Elementary School for Diatonic Accordions
« Reply #38 on: August 21, 2017, 04:42:50 PM »

Does "normal Griffschrift" mean the Steirisches System / Holzschuh / Seifert?
Sorry, I didn't make it clear enough.

Griffschrift means a tab notation which looks more or less like normal musical notation. The note heads between the lines indicate the buttons on the outer diatonic row of a diatonic accordion, the note heads on the lines indicate the buttons on the next inner diatonic row. This notation for the two outer rows is commono to all variations of Griffschrift.

The following inner rows (one row on Club and one [but with different note layout] to three rows on Steirische) are indicated by #s before the note heads or square note heads or something like this. Here appears a difference between the notation for a Club box and for a Steirische (even if only a three-row Steirische). The indication for the two outer rows remains the same for all types of boxes. (Another difference is, of course, the notation of the basses.)

Griffschrift for the Steirische Harmonika didn't exist prior to 1975 (and even than only for three-row Steirische). So you are safe with older editions. Anyway, I wouldn't suppose many new publikations for Club after 1975.

The edition in question is from the 50s and indikates "Handharmonika" (a term used for Club). (It even shows a Club box on the title page) Publications for Steirische Harmonika tend to use the term "Steirische", because it was (more or less) a new type of melodeon emerging in the 1970s.

Thanks, Sebastian. Good information, good to know.

Will
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Willh

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Re: German Melodeon Library - Elementary School for Diatonic Accordions
« Reply #39 on: August 23, 2017, 05:58:37 PM »

It's available for about  ₤10 via German amazon:
https://www.amazon.de/gp/offer-listing/0203907159/ref=dp_olp_used?ie=UTF8&condition=used

I've purchased and received the above from Amazon.de, but it would seem the notation system is slightly different from what it was in the older Mahr/Seifert PDFs that have been made available here on Melnet.

In particular, there are no push/pull notations. Rather, there seems to be a thick black line under some measures:

https://www.trekel.de/10709/Handharmonika-1x1-Bd-1-Mahr-Curt-386207.html

I'm referring to the bits that look like this:

  |-------------------------------------------|

I'm assuming this means "push" as in the middle of page 3 of my new book it says (translated from the German):

"If a short "push" section appears in a long "pull" section, the air button should be held half-in during the "push" section so that the bellows can be quickly closed and a new "pull" section begun."

This then shows 3 bars of "push" playing followed by a single bar with |--------------------------| under it.

Any advice from those in the know?

Thanks,

Will
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