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Author Topic: Voicing vs Tuning and other "Technical" Nomenclature  (Read 4152 times)

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Andrew Culwell

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Voicing vs Tuning and other "Technical" Nomenclature
« on: October 19, 2010, 05:38:05 PM »

So in the interest of discussion about technical terms and accordion tuning I'm posting this out of genuine curiosity.  I posted an accordion for sale in the sales area and had some interesting comments made about the terms used by my technician/tuner/engineer what have you.  The term in question was "voiced".  I was under the impression that instruments in general could be voiced and that it was different than tuning, the post to the contrary seemed to indicate that the term was puffery.  I'm genuinely curious to know if there are terms associated with accordion tuning and technology that are accepted terminology.  In my opinion as technology advances then terminology does the same.  The technician I use is well known for using terms more colorful than other more traditional technicians might, I assume that this is just his way of communicating.  I'm no expert and I learned long ago that he can be quite loquacious when he is talking about his work.  Some of the more interesting terms I have heard him use are "Tremolo adjustment", "Reed tongue adjustment", "Voicing", etc.  I assume he just uses terms that he prefers to describe what he does.  Some of it might be sales but I don't make the distinction.  
« Last Edit: October 19, 2010, 05:40:48 PM by A.J. Culwell »
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Owen Woods

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Re: Voicing vs Tuning and other "Technical" Nomenclature
« Reply #1 on: October 19, 2010, 05:42:15 PM »

I suppose that filing reed tongues has an effect other than on the tuning, it also changes the sound. I suppose the voicing might mean making sure that the tuning has not adversely affected the sound of the instrument. A theory :P
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Andy Simpson

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Re: Voicing vs Tuning and other "Technical" Nomenclature
« Reply #2 on: October 19, 2010, 06:16:44 PM »

The trouble is that "voicing" is a pretty ambiguous and rather malleable term.

Ironically, I have a real problem with people who claim to "tune" or "tap tune" the soundboards of stringed instruments because "tuning" implies some sort of firm definition and a degree of precision far beyond what they're actually doing and I think voicing is a much more appropriate term.

In the way I understand and use the term relating to stringed instruments, voicing is tailoring an instrument to deliver the sound you or the customer wants and is part of the design and execution, not something you can alter later without major structural changes. You can change the sound of a guitar somewhat by fitting heavier strings, raising the action and using a different material for the saddle but I wouldn't consider that "voicing", which to me would be would be things like using different timbers, making the body deeper or shallower and altering the soundboard and bracing to achieve the desired effect.

I don't know exactly what he means by voicing, as I said, it doesn't really have a proper definiton and people can argue it means different things but I wouldn't say you can send a completed instrument off to be "voiced".
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rees

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Re: Voicing vs Tuning and other "Technical" Nomenclature
« Reply #3 on: October 19, 2010, 06:30:22 PM »

The way I understand voicing is the setting of the gap between the reed tongue and the reed plate to give the best response.
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Theo

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Re: Voicing vs Tuning and other "Technical" Nomenclature
« Reply #4 on: October 19, 2010, 06:38:54 PM »

The way I understand voicing is the setting of the gap between the reed tongue and the reed plate to give the best response.

I understand the same, though I prefer the term 'reed setting'  because voicing seem to suggest modifications to the sound quality, which is not affected by setting the reed gap.
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Andrew Culwell

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Re: Voicing vs Tuning and other "Technical" Nomenclature
« Reply #5 on: October 19, 2010, 06:41:31 PM »

Rees,
 from how he has explained it that is exactly what he is referring to. 
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Andy Simpson

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Re: Voicing vs Tuning and other "Technical" Nomenclature
« Reply #6 on: October 19, 2010, 06:54:47 PM »

I prefer the term 'reed setting'  because voicing seem to suggest modifications to the sound quality, which is not affected by setting the reed gap.

I agree entirely with that.

Unfortunately, there's an awful lot of misleading terms and hyperbole in the world of instruments...just ask your local master luthier.
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Re: Voicing vs Tuning and other "Technical" Nomenclature
« Reply #7 on: October 19, 2010, 07:00:37 PM »

The way I understand voicing is the setting of the gap between the reed tongue and the reed plate to give the best response.

Is that what it means? I would never have guessed that :P
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Graham Spencer

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Re: Voicing vs Tuning and other "Technical" Nomenclature
« Reply #8 on: October 19, 2010, 07:49:54 PM »

In organ building "voicing" refers to adjusting the timbre (by changing the shape of the airway) of the pipes to give fuller, softer, harsher, sweeter or whatever tones are required from a particular bank of pipes. I'm not sure you can actually do that with a free reed instrument.
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Chris Ryall

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Re: Voicing vs Tuning and other "Technical" Nomenclature
« Reply #9 on: October 20, 2010, 07:49:00 AM »

'Tuning' is definitely frequency/pitch - no problem.   

Voicing is the problem one for me as I can 'voice' a G7 chord in 3 different ways on the Oakwood and all have different texture.

As 'voicing' is actually a very standard musical word referring to the way we play chords - I feel it's then an egregious folly to then use the same word to describe something wrt a single reed!  (However it appears organ makers have gone that way)

 "Voicing" of a set of say 3 reeds to get {demi swing + low} sound - as per Castagnari Mori might make more sense.

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Marje

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Re: Voicing vs Tuning and other "Technical" Nomenclature
« Reply #10 on: October 20, 2010, 08:56:42 AM »

I've always thought of the "voices" as the different effects I can get by varying the use of the three stops on the melody side of my melodeon. I would also use "voice" to describe the sound of one instrument ( or one reed) against that of another, playing the same note (e.g. bright or mellow, wet-tuned or dry, rich or grunty).

This is not, you'll understand, a technical explanation of how these voices are achieved, which is something I'll leave to others. But I do think we need a word for the end result that we hear when we play, and if that isn't "voice", I don't know what it is.
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Re: Voicing vs Tuning and other "Technical" Nomenclature
« Reply #11 on: October 20, 2010, 09:41:21 AM »

As 'voicing' is actually a very standard musical word referring to the way we play chords - I feel it's then an egregious folly to then use the same word to describe something wrt a single reed!  (However it appears organ makers have gone that way)
Ah - but that's language for you! We always borrow words from one usage and apply the same words to different usage. (Consider the word 'gay' now....   :o )
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Re: Voicing vs Tuning and other "Technical" Nomenclature
« Reply #12 on: October 20, 2010, 09:41:44 AM »

Colin Dipper, the renowned and respected concertina maker, makes his own concertina reeds.

He told me that voicing involves not only adjusting the gap or 'set' of the reed in its frame (which controls the responsiveness of the reed) but also the way in which the reed is profiled. A longitudinal cross section of a concertina reed tongue shows that the taper of the tongue from clamp to tip is not often merely a linear wedge shape, but a complex curve, mostly concave upwards. This is especially noticeable on the larger reeds. The shape of this curve can have a definite effect on the frequency and intensity of the harmonics produced by the reed, and hence its sound quality or timbre. I think that similar parameters control the sound of melodeon reeds.

Tuning a reed (concertina or melodeon) involves filing or scraping the reed and inevitably makes minute changes to the longitudinal profile. Adjusting the gap can also affect the pitch of the reed slightly, so once the gap has been correctly set, there may be some tiny adjustments in pitch needed which will involve more filing. However, filing a reed may alter the stress field in the steel, so that it bends slightly, so that the gap has to be readjusted...... And so it goes on. And when you also consider that the pitch of a reed can vary depending on the bellows pressure applied, it's a wonder that any reed can be made to sound in tune and with an acceptable timbre.

Voicing and tuning reeds is an art and a skill which has to be learned through experience and being in possession of a good ear. The best reed technicians and tuners know just how to apply all the compromises involved so that the ultimate goal is achieved: an instrument with a great quality of sound and playing (apparently) in tune across its pitch and dynamic range.
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Andrew Culwell

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Re: Voicing vs Tuning and other "Technical" Nomenclature
« Reply #13 on: October 20, 2010, 03:04:40 PM »

Steve,
I had a very similar explanation from Mr Usui in almost the same terms.  I think that laymen often assume that technicians simply perform standard technical tasks and that there is no art or craftmanship in this kind of work.  Like a technician on an assembly line performing his task in an automatic way.  Each box is different and sounds different and must be tuned and "voiced" if you will differently.  If the sounds that come out of our own vocal chords are termed "voice" then what keeps us from saying each instrument has it's own unique voice.  Myabe it's sophistry, but I don't think it's a stretch.  I think it denigrates the accordion technicians art when we limit his use of descriptive terms to a standard that we think is acceptable.  
« Last Edit: October 20, 2010, 03:14:15 PM by A.J. Culwell »
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rees

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Re: Voicing vs Tuning and other "Technical" Nomenclature
« Reply #14 on: October 20, 2010, 04:49:42 PM »

Steve,
I had a very similar explanation from Mr Usui in almost the same terms.  I think that laymen often assume that technicians simply perform standard technical tasks and that there is no art or craftmanship in this kind of work.  Like a technician on an assembly line performing his task in an automatic way.  Each box is different and sounds different and must be tuned and "voiced" if you will differently.  If the sounds that come out of our own vocal chords are termed "voice" then what keeps us from saying each instrument has it's own unique voice.  Myabe it's sophistry, but I don't think it's a stretch.  I think it denigrates the accordion technicians art when we limit his use of descriptive terms to a standard that we think is acceptable.  

I totally agree. When building accordions, I am fascinated by the unique sound of each instrument. That moment, after fitting the reeds, when the instrument is finally complete and it gives "voice" for the first time - it floors me every time. That is the raw material which I must mould, tease and manipulate to produce the final character. Whatever the reeds, whatever the timber, whatever the construction method, the voice defines the music.
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Re: Voicing vs Tuning and other "Technical" Nomenclature
« Reply #15 on: October 20, 2010, 05:13:06 PM »

Quote
Whatever the reeds, whatever the timber, whatever the construction method, the voice defines the music.
Agreed! Enabling the reed to give it's very best sound by adjusting the gapping, the profile, the curvature etc. 'Voicing' is not an inappropriate term for what is more than simply tuning a box to concert pitch.
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Re: Voicing vs Tuning and other "Technical" Nomenclature
« Reply #16 on: October 20, 2010, 06:03:33 PM »

In pipe organ terms voicing is very different to tuning, it starts pre setting out the sheets to cut out and develop into the pipes with the metal composition and thickness, the size and shape of the languid and the shape and geometry of the conical and tubular bits which are joined to form a metal flue pipe all have an effect to the ultimate sound. Reeds stops are even more complex as there is the reed and shallot (reed bed equivalent ?) plus the tuning rod before the shape of resonator (= pipe) is considered. (similar true of wooden pipes but I've not seen this done first hand)

The operation of voicing is done by the rank of pipes to balance both tone and strength, in mixtures (multiple pipes per note) each pipe is voiced then the combination together.

This is primarily a 'tweaking' process where air admission hole size and degree of cupping, width of languid (= size of slot for air to escape and edge over which it gets disturbed) mouth opening and wings either side are cut orered bent to give the required 'colour' and intensity of sound, thereafter the tuners of successive generations will adjust the frequency delivered.

Compared to the free reed instrument where most of this has been established by the reed or box manufacturers by design, materials and in manufacture there appears to be a limited amount of effect for tuners to affect the sound quality delivered - otherwise there would not be the demand for various makes and grades of reeds to deliver differing sounds, however, when a reed gets hung up or there is a valve problem we soon notice the downside of the 'colour' changing even if the note might be the right frequency. The reed tuner may have to incorporate a degree of voicing even though it is not perhaps recognised or named as such as a replacement reed needs to sound like its counterparts on the same row and I have tried several 2 rows where there is a distinct difference in sound between to rows

I think this is a term which may be used widely across instruments but may have more or less effect depending on the instrument itself but is probably safe to regard as part of the manufacturing rather than the maintenance part of an instruments life.

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