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Author Topic: Roland fr18 diatonic accordion - user group  (Read 213120 times)

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Clive Williams

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Re: Roland fr18 diatonic accordion - user group
« Reply #520 on: November 04, 2014, 08:44:15 AM »

Oh, that's neat. I should be able to do the same on a streb perhaps? Will have to give it a go...

DaveW

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Re: Roland fr18 diatonic accordion - user group
« Reply #521 on: December 29, 2014, 07:56:18 PM »

Rather than trying to hack the FR-18 to play my own samples, I just went with an external MIDI solution using an iPod Touch (would also work on iPhone/iPad) running MIDI stream processing and sample-based synth apps:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v9xywp2woEY

Well that certainly is a good sound - completely baffled watching the set up - but did see something about Holy Moley - that seemed to sum things up. Well done to Seisuneer though and yes Roland should take note

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DaveW

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Sven

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Re: Roland fr18 diatonic accordion - user group
« Reply #522 on: January 07, 2015, 10:11:09 AM »

Maybe people who have nice samples to use with this accordeon can share them here? It would be nice to have a range of samples to choose from :).
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Clive Williams

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Re: Roland fr18 diatonic accordion - user group
« Reply #523 on: January 08, 2015, 09:28:24 AM »

Oh, that's neat. I should be able to do the same on a streb perhaps? Will have to give it a go...

With apologies for the drift, I tried this last night with the Streb plugged into an iPad running ThumbJam using iRig Midi. Oh my. That's *fantastic*. Didn't need to use the midi mapping tool that Michael uses with the FR18, but did experiment with the basses a bit (on the Streb) to get the octaves right. As for software on the iPad, ThumbJam (about £6.00 to buy) was enough - didn't need anything else.

Sven

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Re: Roland fr18 diatonic accordion - user group
« Reply #524 on: January 09, 2015, 09:10:05 AM »

Mine arrived yesterday :)
Didn't have much time to try it yet, but i can understand the reactions people have to this instrument. There are some good sides to it, the standard sound isn't that good, but with what i could quickly find in settings the melody side could already be configured to sound somewhat decent :).
Also read the manual, so this weekend i'll figure out all the settings and set it up the way i want it for now :).
All in all i'm pleased, it's nice how light it plays, i could instantly just play on it as i'm used to, and that was a nice surprise :).
I think i'm going to have fun with this instrument, but it'll never replace a real accordion XD.
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welsh

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Re: Roland fr18 diatonic accordion - user group
« Reply #525 on: January 09, 2015, 04:50:30 PM »

Just got mine also, will be befuddled for while I am sure but looking forward to getting to grips with it. Also be good to compare with my Streb as well.

Trev
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Chris Brimley

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Re: Roland fr18 diatonic accordion - user group
« Reply #526 on: January 09, 2015, 05:47:56 PM »

I must admit that having lived with mine for some months now, I do feel that if only I had the ability to sort out the standard sound, and one or two other minor issues, it would indeed be amazingly good!  It's such a shame - so close and yet ...
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EricJamesWhite

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Re: Roland fr18 diatonic accordion - user group
« Reply #527 on: February 26, 2015, 10:25:53 AM »

Had mine for just over a month. I am amazed at how well it plays - action and sound. And I have been playing "real" melodeons for over 30 years.

Some of the criticisms I have read about don't seem to be issues. Complexity - yes, but I have learned to be expert in my own sub-set of requirements. Plastic - certainly, but it doesn't need to be wood because it doesn't require acoustic resonance. I thought the constant air flow through the bellows would be a major concern but to be honest I haven't noticed it - maybe that's because I rarely play more than one note at a time?

I love being able to design my own keyboard layouts. I have mainly played D/G melodeons so there is a tablature for me but the bass buttons were too far away from the air button for my small hands so I simply moved them nearer using the tablature maker - brilliant.

When a singer I am accompanying decides G is too low and adjusts their capo to G# the I simply do the same!

So, overall I just love it  (:)
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Chris Brimley

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Re: Roland fr18 diatonic accordion - user group
« Reply #528 on: February 26, 2015, 10:37:39 AM »

What sound set configuration do you find you're using, Eric?
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EricJamesWhite

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Re: Roland fr18 diatonic accordion - user group
« Reply #529 on: February 26, 2015, 04:14:44 PM »

Hi Chris

I saved the sounds to the 4 User Programs but can't remember how I got to them - I think this is an age thing! I saved the reed formats as MMM, MM and LMM, and the 4th User Program is Violin. I intend to turn the Reverb and Chorus off as this improved the sound on a Roland FR1x that I have. Brought up on Hohner Pokerworks I like the wet sound so I have left the Musette Detune on the factory setting but, from what I have read somewhere - maybe earlier in this thread, reducing the musette effect can can help to get near to the dry sound of the modern Italian melodeons.

When I get chance I will try to reverse engineer the sounds and let you know what they are.
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Chris Brimley

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Re: Roland fr18 diatonic accordion - user group
« Reply #530 on: February 26, 2015, 06:07:57 PM »

I've just had a similar age-related (?) experience - I'm trying to set up a new tablature.  I've followed the instructions to the letter, and I know it's on the USB stick in the right RDKC2.XML because I've checked with tablature maker.  I plug it in, just like it says in the importing tablature sets section, but when I press the register 2, and then the set register again, nothing's happened.  I'm blowed if I know why not - can anyone help?  Actually perhaps it's just as well, because I don't want to lose one of the other tablatures that I have managed to import previously, but which doesn't seem to be on the stick, although I thought I'd saved it!  Confused.
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DaveW

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Re: Roland fr18 diatonic accordion - user group
« Reply #531 on: February 26, 2015, 07:38:26 PM »

Chris
I take it that you are following page 39 in the manual 'Importing tablature sets'. The process is difficult to follow: First prepare your new tablature, save it along with 11 others which you may have previously altered. (you describe saving RDKC2.XML - not RDCK2.XML - like I did) Then on to: Slow flashing Set register, button 37 used, quick flashing Set Register, yellow treble register no 2, finally Set Register again to exit. Noting that you import a full set of 12 tablatures.
It is a long time since I did all this and as you say memory fails with age. Even more difficult to get your (OK then my) head round was loading saved User Programme Sets UO1-4.USD and User Set memories SO1-4.STD. I've forgotten the difference now. The other paragraph on P39 talks of expansion sounds - which we would all like, but do not seem to be available. I bought my FR-18 in 2011 and it took ages to decide on four user programme sets with a reasonable sound. I tend just to use these now but it is easy to set up new arrangements, just write down what you have used. 1R.3Y describes a sound. Specify the tab used and also the key selected and Bob's your Uncle
Good luck to the several new users
DaveW
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DaveW

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Chris Brimley

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Re: Roland fr18 diatonic accordion - user group
« Reply #532 on: February 26, 2015, 07:55:27 PM »

Thanks Dave - yes on P39 (top right) there's a typo on the filename - but I just clicked on the name given automatically, so I think that must have worked OK (unless the error is with all the filenames.)  I think I followed exactly what you say, but for some reason nothing happened.  Am I perhaps inadvertently in a User-specified setting, possibly?  The manual is somewhat short on definitions of terms, I find.  It also doesn't very clearly explain the purpose of the 4 different filenames - I think I previously imagined the FR18 somehow stored 4 sets of 12 tablatures which the register buttons could select, but now I'm inclined to the view that they're just alternatives to load into one set of 12?
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Chris Brimley

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Re: Roland fr18 diatonic accordion - user group
« Reply #533 on: February 26, 2015, 08:05:03 PM »

On the sounds, I managed too to store my preferred voicings, parameters, and keys, when first setting it up.  However I just wondered if Eric had achieved a better result than I have, hence my question to him.  I too have given up on the expansion sounds, but I do occasionally wonder if it's somehow possible to set up .BID files, whatever they are, without going through Roland.  Presumably they wouldn't have used the file extension term in the manual if it was just peculiar to Roland?
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DaveW

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Re: Roland fr18 diatonic accordion - user group
« Reply #534 on: February 26, 2015, 09:29:56 PM »

Thanks Dave - yes on P39 (top right) there's a typo on the filename - but I just clicked on the name given automatically, so I think that must have worked OK (unless the error is with all the filenames.)  I think I followed exactly what you say, but for some reason nothing happened.  Am I perhaps inadvertently in a User-specified setting, possibly?  The manual is somewhat short on definitions of terms, I find.  It also doesn't very clearly explain the purpose of the 4 different filenames - I think I previously imagined the FR18 somehow stored 4 sets of 12 tablatures which the register buttons could select, but now I'm inclined to the view that they're just alternatives to load into one set of 12?

Yes I think that's right, you load one set of 12 tabulatures at a time. The files seem to load in an instant. Roland terminology is difficult. Do I remember a lag at the final keystroke, followed by the stated light going off? All the flashing lights, quick and slow need to happen too. Again good luck
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DaveW

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Chris Brimley

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Re: Roland fr18 diatonic accordion - user group
« Reply #535 on: February 26, 2015, 11:03:22 PM »

I now understand the importance of the comment about remembering all 12 tablatures are replaced at once, because I've realised that there doesn't seem to be any way of selecting one tablature from one set of 12, and copying that tablature into another set of 12.  I've tried cutting and pasting in the data files, but you can't.  Unless anyone's found a way of doing this?

This means that if you want two new tablatures, you must make sure you put them both in the same RDKCx.XML file, otherwise you can't play both without reloading from a stick each time you change.  Perhaps that's what the manual should have said!  The annoying thing is that what takes the time is feeding in all the notes into a tablature from a long drop-down menu, which you have to scroll down.  110 times!  And now I've got to do it all again.  Grrr.
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DaveW

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Re: Roland fr18 diatonic accordion - user group
« Reply #536 on: February 27, 2015, 02:54:05 AM »

Chris
Yes, after loading RDCKx.??? you need to select you newly designed tablature ('tab' key then no. key 1-12 from inside row of buttons, and then select the music key for the outside row of your chosen tab - for instance if you have set up GDA melodeon, select 'Key' A).
As for preparing several tabs, just select a suitable (similar) master version and modify that in 'Tablature' programme and save it as one of your twelve tablatures. You can do this for several versions in your chosen twelve and save the lot as one RDCK2.??? file. Load this and then away you go, perm any one tablature from twelve.
I think tab 11 gives a three row in GCF with the set key as G. You could probably play this as ADG just by changing the key to A. But what I did was to type in the whole thing for ADG - should really read GDA - (set key A) and save that as tab 11. I have also set up several bcc# selections based on modified tab 6 which I think is a two row bc 'key' selected as B. These are saved as tab 2, tab 6 and tab 4 I think. Choosing suitable basses was a headache
What I wish I had done at the start was to fully explore the available tablatures, modifying their set keys to suit DG or ADG. The trouble with that is you don't then know what basses you are using. I went through the pictures and labelled them with what I thought they were. 'GC with full row of accidentals', 'Organetto with reversals in key G' things like that. Hope all this helps
DaveW
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DaveW

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Vallenato831

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Re: Roland fr18 diatonic accordion - user group
« Reply #537 on: February 27, 2015, 03:29:33 AM »

« Last Edit: February 27, 2015, 03:32:04 AM by Vallenato831 »
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Chris Brimley

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Re: Roland fr18 diatonic accordion - user group
« Reply #538 on: February 27, 2015, 08:51:35 AM »

Quote
You can do this for several versions in your chosen twelve and save the lot as one RDCK2.??? file. Load this and then away you go, perm any one tablature from twelve.

Dave - Yes, I do understand this now, that it has to be all in one file  - what I didn't previously realise was that the 'copy' command in TabMaker does not allow you to copy your new tablatures one at a time to a RDKC folder, as you might expect it to when managing files - you can only copy all 12 at a time.  This seems to be because the 'file' contains all 12 tablatures together, there are no separate files for each, and the software doesn't allow direct data editing.

As I understand it, you're not suggesting a way of overcoming this problem, except perhaps by changing keys?  If so, I should explain that my first new tablature was my personal D/G/Acc layout (loosely based on 7), but the second new tablature I'm trying to install is an Atzarin layout, it's by no means just key changing alone.  Therefore, I have to modify the previous tab set, I can't modify the original and expect to be able to load both new tabs at the same time.

I notice you're still using the letters RDCK rather than RDKC - have I still got this wrong, in other words are there many typo errors on P39, not just one?  if so, that certainly explains why it won't load!

« Last Edit: February 27, 2015, 08:55:36 AM by Chris Brimley »
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EricJamesWhite

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Re: Roland fr18 diatonic accordion - user group
« Reply #539 on: February 27, 2015, 10:21:18 AM »

Chris, I don't think I have done any better than you in setting up the sounds - it's probably that I like the Roland supplied sounds more than you do. It's just a subjective thing.

By the way, love your band  (:)

But just for the record I followed page 24 of the manual and used Folk/Folk and Folk/Diatonic. I then set the Sound (reed combination)using the info on pages 25 and 60. But I am sure I am "teaching grannie to suck eggs"!

I have promised myself I would investigate the BID file thing but nobody seems to be able to get anywhere. Has everyone drawn a blank?
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