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Author Topic: Roland fr18 diatonic accordion - user group  (Read 213139 times)

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Chris Brimley

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Re: Roland fr18 diatonic accordion - user group
« Reply #540 on: February 27, 2015, 01:06:18 PM »

Success!  My main problem turned out to be a dodgy USB socket - I pressed the stick to one side, that made the connection, and the updating then worked.  As you said Dave, it seems it is supposed to remove the yellow and red lights when it has uploaded, as happened this time for me.

Eric, thanks for the reply - yes, sure, that's pretty much what I did too, and I also found changing the reverb and chorus settings helped me a bit, but somehow it's still not realistic enough.  Roland did admit to me that the new expansion sounds are not available through them. I urged them to listen to the stunning results seisiuneer has achieved with the MIDI output, but without useful response, I regret to say.

I feel the realism problem is to do with the reed sound simulation simply not being good enough, it's not related to the changeable parameters.  If only they could crack that, the FR18 would become much more popular.
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welsh

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Re: Roland fr18 diatonic accordion - user group
« Reply #541 on: February 27, 2015, 03:15:40 PM »

Not sure if you are referring to the expansion sounds Chris, but they are available via Roland. USA. If I can't get them through Swansea here, I will get them sent to my son in law in California and see how they go. The only one they say is compatible with the FR-18 is the Oberkrainer type Alpine sound expansion. Would be nice if the Dallape version worked though...

See pages
http://shop.rolandus.com/p/alpine-sound-library

and

https://www.rolandus.com/go/v-accordion/expansion.html

Think someone did post a way to work some sounds earlier in the thread.

Trev
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Chris Brimley

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Re: Roland fr18 diatonic accordion - user group
« Reply #542 on: February 27, 2015, 03:42:15 PM »

That's very interesting, Trev - although I'm not sure I want to play like an alpine box player, it does suggest the on-board technology is in place to allow changes in the reed sound to happen.

The earlier post I think you're referring to was seisiuneer's excellent results using MIDI output and sampled sounds via an ipad.
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welsh

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Re: Roland fr18 diatonic accordion - user group
« Reply #543 on: February 27, 2015, 04:35:33 PM »

No Chris was referring to GanAimn 's post on page 21, he got hold of the other expansion. If they don't work will put them in my FR-3X and that should be interesting, more slots in there too for the expansions.

Trev
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DaveW

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Re: Roland fr18 diatonic accordion - user group
« Reply #544 on: February 27, 2015, 05:34:43 PM »


I notice you're still using the letters RDCK rather than RDKC - have I still got this wrong, in other words are there many typo errors on P39, not just one?  if so, that certainly explains why it won't load!

Chris that was me typing very late at night - I'm an insomniac who also plays silent fr-18 in the wee small hours
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DaveW

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DaveW

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Re: Roland fr18 diatonic accordion - user group
« Reply #545 on: February 27, 2015, 05:47:01 PM »

Quote
If so, I should explain that my first new tablature was my personal D/G/Acc layout (loosely based on 7), but the second new tablature I'm trying to install is an Atzarin layout, it's by no means just key changing alone.  Therefore, I have to modify the previous tab set, I can't modify the original and expect to be able to load both new tabs at the same time.

My recollection is that you can save your newly created tablature into the RDKC2 file with a different number from its ancestor - doing this several times if you like and you can then load up to 12 variants of Atzarin layout with rather less work than pulling down and clicking every note in each new layout

Glad you sorted out loading the RDKC2. Who/what is Atzarin? or perhaps it is your secret weapon?
« Last Edit: February 27, 2015, 05:56:10 PM by DaveW »
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DaveW

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Chris Brimley

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Re: Roland fr18 diatonic accordion - user group
« Reply #546 on: February 27, 2015, 05:58:41 PM »

You're right, Dave - the copy tablature button allows you to save it into another tablature in the same file, or in another file.  Without having tried it, I imagined it was just copying the whole set.  That's just what I wanted - why do I always seem to do things the long way!

(The Atzarin's not my secret weapon btw, it's Sebastian's.  See: http://forum.melodeon.net/index.php/topic,12305.0.html, or the Atzarin website, or read Owen's review.)
« Last Edit: February 27, 2015, 06:07:03 PM by Chris Brimley »
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Chris Brimley

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Re: Roland fr18 diatonic accordion - user group
« Reply #547 on: February 27, 2015, 06:08:57 PM »

(Thank you everyone for the helpful advice on modifying tablatures - I now understand how it works, and have managed to do the changes, because of your help.)
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jerfish

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Re: Roland fr18 diatonic accordion - user group
« Reply #548 on: May 31, 2015, 05:26:18 PM »

I got one last week as an attempt to make me play more often due to the Best feature of this accordion for me: headphones!  I was still a bit self-conscious like I'm bothering people in my home.  This may be what I need to actually focus on the melodeon again. Throw in the fun factor playing with the different sounds and the fact you can try different accordion arrangements without having to buy them -- I find it quite useful.

I do have a chronic left shoulder issue and I'm trying to find a good position for playing that will not exacerbate it (which could apply to any instrument).  It's the pull not the push.  I have seen some players drop the left shoulder strap so that it hangs at a 45° angle down to the left. I Imagine this with the gravity would help  somewhat but change the ergonomics of the right arm.
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EricJamesWhite

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Re: Roland fr18 diatonic accordion - user group
« Reply #549 on: June 01, 2015, 04:44:38 PM »

Congratulations. I'm sure you won't regret it - I play nothing else now.
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EricJamesWhite

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Re: Roland fr18 diatonic accordion - user group
« Reply #550 on: June 26, 2015, 04:53:41 PM »

A friend of mine told me that the Dallape Sound Expansion was available free for download quite a while ago. He kindly sent me the files but said that they didn't work on the FR18 and this proved to be true. After a few days of effort, with more than a little help from my friend, I managed to get 3 sets (accordions) working although I could not get the Dallape bass section to work so I have used an FR18 standard F-Folk2.

The 3 accordions are:
    1871 Semi-diatonic accordion
    Supermaestro IV Organtone (2010)
    Supermaestro V “Centenario (1976)

So I have got the first and last accordions that Dallape produced and one in the middle!

If anyone is interested please let me know.
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Chris Brimley

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Re: Roland fr18 diatonic accordion - user group
« Reply #551 on: July 10, 2015, 04:28:25 PM »

I'm not sure whether this merits a different thread or not, and squeezy has noted that he's not really a user, but  I think his comments on the diatonic origins thread are very pertinent for us FR18 users.  I have to say that the only time I've noticed a wrong note reversal has been with light pressure using a fretless bass guitar sound, and I actually found I could use it deliberately.  Has anyone else found this to be a problem?

I also thought his comments on the overall sound quality are unfortunately also persuasive.  I think Roland should take this seriously, if they want to improve their product.

What do other users think about these issues?
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squeezy

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Re: Roland fr18 diatonic accordion - user group
« Reply #552 on: July 11, 2015, 12:24:08 AM »

Non user in the user group alert!

I have noticed that particular problem on every single Roland FR18 I've tried - you're right that it's pretty minimal when you analyse it, but it really does contribute to the slightly sluggish and out of control feel when playing normally.
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Squeezy

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brazilian.BOX

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Re: Roland fr18 diatonic accordion - user group
« Reply #553 on: July 11, 2015, 03:05:11 AM »

This FR-18 Roland really makes me tempted... recently I saw one in an amazing offer in an italian website. It was that model in RED color, really my favorite. This offer from Italy I lost... the price was so amazing (the box used, but really brand new but announced by exactly the HALF of the common price to the zero km models) so, obviously someone came before, as I was thinking and fantasizing about  ::)  hahahaahaha

But I am really curious about this model, and this technology with amplifiers inside... and stuff.
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EricJamesWhite

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Re: Roland fr18 diatonic accordion - user group
« Reply #554 on: July 12, 2015, 09:02:36 PM »

I have a Hyde Alchemist Midi melodeon and when it is first switched on the air pressure sensor detects the internal bellows air pressure and uses this to detect whether the bellows are being pushed (increases pressure from startup pressure) or being pulled (decreases pressure). If for any reason the startup pressure is incorrect (ie if the bellows are being pushed when melodeon switched on) then note reversal will tend to happen. To rectify this Hyde suggest that when the melodeon is switched on the bellows should be open with the air button open. The Hyde also allows you to set the pressure at which a note fist sounds. Note reversal can be almost eliminated. I have never experienced note reversal on the FR18 but I always have the air button open when I switch on.

Chris, I find the sounds on the FR18 very good but that could be cos I'm a bit deaf! But I would be interested in what you think of the Dallape expansion. I could send the files if you wish to try it.
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EricJamesWhite

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Re: Roland fr18 diatonic accordion - user group
« Reply #555 on: July 13, 2015, 10:41:39 AM »

Hi brazilian.BOX. I have a red one - very distinctive!

You can get loads of info from reading this forum although it will take you a long time. You will see that there are different opinions regarding how good it is compared to an acoustic box. You will also see that there are an infinite number of adjustments you can make and therefore it requires time and effort to set it up to your liking.

I feel guilty about playing a midi instrument but I have been drawn more and more towards it so that now I rarely use anything else. I play it thru a Roland Micro Cube RX.

So, what do I like about it:
* To my ears the sounds are good and realistic (especially the Dallape Sound Expansion)
* I can swap from sounding like a Jimmy Shand band to a raw melodeon at the press of a button
* I am a D/G player so it allows me to accompany singers in strange keys such as F#

For a D/G melodeon player it is a little heavy although I don't notice it once I have put it on. However, for a Shand Morino player I would imagine it is extremely light.

It is a major investment so so due thought and consideration is required.

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Chris Brimley

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Re: Roland fr18 diatonic accordion - user group
« Reply #556 on: July 13, 2015, 12:05:49 PM »

I would indeed be very interested to try the Dallape expansion, thanks Eric - are we taking about files that can just be inserted via the USB stick, or using the MIDI output via a PC?  You seemed to be saying earlier it wouldn't work with a FR18 (which matches what Roland UK told me about sounds in general), or have I misunderstood?
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howard mitchell

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Re: Roland fr18 diatonic accordion - user group
« Reply #557 on: July 13, 2015, 12:15:39 PM »

I'd also be interested to try the Dallape expansion set. I've successfully loaded the Oberkramer expansion set.

Thanks

Mitch
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EricJamesWhite

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Re: Roland fr18 diatonic accordion - user group
« Reply #558 on: July 13, 2015, 12:48:05 PM »

Hi Chris

Funny isn't it when you send a post that you think is crystal clear but when you read it again some weeks later you can't even understand it yourself!

The system is the BID and SET files that are loaded into the User Program areas via a USB memory stick

The original files in the Dallape Sound Expansion won't work on the FR18 so I had to do some hokey pokey to get them to work. You don't need to go into all that. All you will need to do is:
1) Import Dallape Sound Expansion: Manual - Importing optional expansion sounds - p39
2) Load the User Sets: Manual - Loading User Set memories from a USB memory - p38

I have copied my instruction file (that I will come with the ZIP file) below.

This will give you some idea of what is involved so if you still want the files (in ZIP format) please let me know how I can get them to you. I think it is too large to attach to this post (7MB)

Eric


DALLAPE SOUND EXPANSION for FR18

FILES

Sound Expansion File
     W02.BID  Dallape Sound Expansion

User Sets
     S01.STD        (1871 Semi-diatonic accordion)
     S02.STD        (Supermaestro IV Organtone (2010))
     S03.STD        (Supermaestro V Centenario (1976))


INSTRUCTIONS

(1) Import Dallape Sound Expansion
     Manual - Importing optional expansion sounds - p39
     (store in internal sound expansion bank 1 or 2 - doesn't matter which)

(2) Load the User Sets
     Manual - Loading User Set memories from a USB memory - p38
     There are 3 User Set memories so you can load all three user sets or just your favourite(s).
     The number of the User Set file name does not dictate the User Set memory location
          so S01.STD does not have to go in User Set memory number 1


NOTES

No matter how I tried I could not get the Dallape bass sections to work so I have used F-Folk2.

The Orchestra sections are all the same on the three User Set files.

To make changes simply
     download the Roland Set Editor
     change the extension of the User Set file from STD to ST3
     use the FR-3x part of the Set Editor to make the changes and create the new set file (ST3)
     rename the extension back to STD
     Eg  S01.STD -> S01.ST3 -> S01.STD
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xgx

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Re: Roland fr18 diatonic accordion - user group
« Reply #559 on: July 13, 2015, 12:49:45 PM »

Eric, you have a pm  (:)
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Graham

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