Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[Steve_freereeder]

In other words, 'diatonic' sort of means 'through the tones' - 'ditonic' or 'bitonic', if they existed as words, would mean 'two-tone'.

Nah... 'two-tone' refers to colours, surely? You know - like when you send someone down to the stores for a tin of red and white striped paint.

[Chris Brimley]

I know, Steve, I was thinking of those fancy boxes Flaco plays!

[Martin J]

An excellent article Steve.  Terminology seems to be the most disputed item.  Through following ebay I have found terms such a Knobf Akkordeon, Accordion Diatonic etc.  Perhaps a general appeal to all mel-neters of every nation could give a lexicon of international terms.

[Theo]

Ha!  Mini-revelation (for me, you probably all know this already!):

'Dia' does not mean 'two', it's a Greek word meaning 'through'.  In other words, 'diatonic' sort of means 'through the tones'.

'Ditonic' or 'bitonic', if they existed as words, would mean 'two-tone'.

The world of diatonic accordions already has so many words used in inconsistent ways, we really don't need any more.   pleeeeease!

[Chris Brimley]

So how should it be avoided, Theo?  That's the tricky one!

[Theo]

I don't think we can avoid the confusing and inconsistent terminology that we are lumbered with.  Language is such a dynamic thing, even if we came up with a well thought out and logical box taxonomy there is no way we could make it a standard that everyone uses.   And if it doesn't become a near universal standard then it just makes things worse! 

I'm reminded of the quote about the interview with a senior IT industry figure being asked why they don't have a standard system so that different types of kit are compatible. The reply was "We love Standards… …that’s why we have so many of them."

[Andy in Vermont]

Steve,
I'm so glad that you are working on this! Great project.
-Andy

[Chris Brimley]

OK, I'm going to withdraw any suggestion that 'diatonic' is an unfortunate word to use.

(My original concern was based on the idea that if you have lots of accidentals, which seems to be a future direction in the box world, it's just a partial concept of button layout, rather than a future-proof defining characteristic of the instrument itself, so I see 'along-the-row diatonic' layouts as just some among very many button layouts for button accordions.  However 'diatonists' in general do seem to have a strong sense of their separate culture, so let it be.)

[nfldbox]

As to bisonoric. Seems to me it should be avoided because I don't think anyone uses it outside the accordion world.

[Graham Spencer]

As to bisonoric. Seems to me it should be avoided because I don't think anyone uses it outside the accordion world.

Except that there is no unambiguous synonym, AFAIK.

[Stiamh]

Second draft, in Google docs this time. I've tried to take into account most of your comments and have added some other stuff. A few sections remain to be completed. Volunteers still welcome!

Thanks for all your help so far and keep it coming. I'm not looking for pats on the back - plenty of those above , grazie tanto - but suggestions for improvements -- including minor edits, typos, and nit-picky points of detail as well as structural considerations.

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1iSSwTdi6C0gBEI0AJKoSCdP3SBZRGVFKg4qikf2OoU4/edit

I don't know if you'll be able to edit or comment on the document in Google docs - I tried to specify not, because I don't want to work in Google docs. I'd prefer to read your feedback and comments here.

Note: bits between asterisks are notes to the reader and not part of the article.

Cheers
S

[Steve_freereeder]

Steve - it's looking good!

Three comments:
1. If you possibly feel able to, please, please, ditch the 'single action/double-action' keyboard thing. I find it extremely confusing and counter-intuitive. (But perhaps it's just me ....)

2. At present, there's no reference to the Club system with its Gleichton. Quite a few players in the UK do use it and in Germany I believe it is quite commonplace still. Historically it is important and there are still many instruments available, both second-hand and new.

3. In your 'International terms' section, perhaps add the Dutch name 'Trekharmonica'. Also in Italy, the generic term for a diatonic button accordion is 'Fisarmonica diatonica'. The term 'Organetto' refers to the more specialised one row or one-and-a-half row instruments, where the half-row consists of 3 or 4 buttons (often slightly smaller diameter) which give reversals of some of the main row buttons.

[Lester]

1. If you possibly feel able to, please, please, ditch the 'single action/double-action' keyboard thing. I find it extremely confusing and counter-intuitive. (But perhaps it's just me ....)

100% agree with Steve especially as, from reading his comment, I guessed thd single action would be "same note both ways" and double action "different notes" but found your interpretation was the other way round

[Stiamh]

Thanks, Steve. Regarding bisonoric etc., I think it is important to use established terminology rather than, or at least as well as, jargon used within a small coterie such as the melodeon/DBA world - as Terry pointed out earlier.

Not "my" interpretation. I took "single-action" and "double-action" from a paper written by Australian ethnomusicologist Graeme Smith. I confess I don't know how widely used these terms are by musicologists or instrument specialists. Will research books and the web a little later.

Similarly the only evidence I have for "bisonoric/unisonoric" is this forum and the existing Wikipedia article. I'll do some more searching on those terms too. In the meantime, do you have any evidence of their wider use? Who first promulgated them, and when?

Cheers
S

[pgroff]

Hi Steve and all,

I remember seeing the "single action" and "double action" terms in the article on free-reeds in this book from 1966:

http://www.classicbooksandephemera.com/shop/classic/001728.html

Unfortunately, my copy (like most of the books I have left) is in storage at the moment so I can't give you the author and title of that chapter.  From memory, that article had a good few errors, lapses, and ommissions, but was still very interesting.

Stephen Chambers and Wim Wakker would definitely be two of many contributors to the current internet forums who have very well-informed and interesting perspectives on these subjects.

PG

[Stiamh]

Thanks Paul. I was thinking of contacting Steve Chambers about a number of points: maybe I'll ask him to vet the article just before going to press as it were.

Googling "single action accordion" (with the quotes, to avoid returning pages that happen to have these three words on them) returns 13,700 results. "bisonoric accordion" (without quotes) returns 12,500 (with quotes, under 1000). It is interesting to note that the first result returned for "single-action accordion" is from Encyclopaedia Britannica.

Clearly, then, "single-action" is an established term and one which, judging from the types of article returned by each search, is used by people outside our little world. For that reason, I propose to continue using it. I have given "bisonoric," despite my lack of enthusiasm for the term, almost equal billing in the article in an attempt to cover all bases.

Those of you who can't get your head around single-action = bisonoric (one = two) might try looking at it another way. Bisonoric focuses on sound, single-action focuses on, well, action. One action = one note. Whereas on a "unisonoric" box, two different actions produce one note. Double-action = two reeds per note. Hope this helps.   


Now back to the drafting.
Steve

[Stiamh]

2. At present, there's no reference to the Club system with its Gleichton. Quite a few players in the UK do use it and in Germany I believe it is quite commonplace still. Historically it is important and there are still many instruments available, both second-hand and new.

How does this addition to an existing paragraph strike you?

Accidentals are sometimes placed on two or extra buttons, or a shorter third row of four or more buttons, close to the bellows. The “Club” system developed by Hohner in the 1950s is a well-established example of this approach. Using the accidentals, and with the added modification of a “Gleichton” (unisonoric second-octave tonic in the middle of the middle row), this system allows players to obtain a fully chromatic scale – albeit in one direction only (draw). For an in-depth discussion of the Club system, see (x-ref to http://www.delaguerre.com/delaguerre/pedagogy/club/intro.html).

3. In your 'International terms' section, perhaps add the Dutch name 'Trekharmonica'. Also in Italy, the generic term for a diatonic button accordion is 'Fisarmonica diatonica'. The term 'Organetto' refers to the more specialised one row or one-and-a-half row instruments, where the half-row consists of 3 or 4 buttons (often slightly smaller diameter) which give reversals of some of the main row buttons.

Done. Incidentally it's trekharmonika (no capital necessary, and with a k).

•   In Italy, a diatonic button accordion is generally a fisarmonic diatonica, while an organetto is a specific type of one-and-a-half-row instrument (discussed below).
•   The Dutch term is trekharmonika.

I'm sure this list could get quite long.

PS The Wikipedia article on concertinas labels bisonoric/unisonoric as "American jargon!"

[mory]

Hi Steve good on you for taking on the task, I'd always understood the terms single action and double action with melnet being the only place I'd found the other terms in use frequently the thing I really wanted to mention though was the other week Wiki was off air and a discussion (I think on BBC Radio 2) started about inaccuracies, anyway it ended with the guy from Wiki P coming on and stating that they only keep stuff on if it verifies with info they find on line and nowhere else, IE if there is info say from the British archives but it cant be verified on line they scrap it There was a guy on who has written several books accepted by the scientific community using archive material that Wiki have taken off because they cant confirm the info on line, which is a real travesty and contributes to the dumbing down of the info out there. don't know if its relevent Steve but thought it worth a mention. All the Best mory

[pgroff]

PS The Wikipedia article on concertinas labels bisonoric/unisonoric as "American jargon!"

Hi Steve,

Again I plead unavailability of my library to check . . . but the first time I remember reading those terms was in Hugh Blake's article describing his invention, the "Diatonion," in an article in Concertina & Squeezebox.  Could he possibly have coined the terms, or this dichotomous usage of them to differentiate between two groups of free reed instruments?

PG

Terminology that covers the whole range of free-reed instruments is tricky, because there are some free-reed instruments, like reed organs and some bass english concertinas (possibly some accordions?), that only have reeds operating in a single direction of air flow for each button or key; with these instruments there might be a single "note" (maybe a single reedtongue, or maybe multiple voices sounding together) corresponding to each key. . . but differing from "double action" instruments such as a typical piano accordion, english concertina, or CBA which also have one "note/voices" corresponding to each button or key -- produced by duplicate reeds for the two bellows directions.  Both those different designs considered together differ from the "two different notes produced by the same button or key, selected by different bellows direction" of our typical melodeons/diatonic button accordions/anglo concertinas etc.

[Stiamh]

Mory, what you say about Wikipedia taking down what they cannot find online confirmation of is alarming... incredible, really. But given their modus operandi and financial resources, I suppose it's hardly surprising.

Paul, I had noted that the Wikipedia article on concertinas uses "single action" for instruments that only produce notes in one bellows direction - such as certain low-pitched English concertinas - and decided to ignore it :) In a sense, though, it doesn't conflict with the way I'm proposing to use the term. The concertina in question works in exactly the same way as a melodeon - it just lacks a second reed for the other direction.   

I don't have any authoritative offline sources to refer to until I can get to a major library. Until then, I'm going to rely on what seems to be a consensus among online sources that use the terms single/double action (Wikipedia's concertina entry notwithstanding).

Surely we cannot hope to clear up all this potential for confusion, nor issue any kind of  prescriptive statement. If we can define our terms, and use them consistently, as far as possible in accordance with the way most other sources are doing, then we'll have done our job.

I'm going to try to get time to put my version online sometime tomorrow. After that, it will be there for anybody to edit. Until then, all comments and suggestions still gratefully received. 

Thanks again.
Steve