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[Rog]

Looking for suggestions for pairs or threes of tunes that go nicely together and for playing in English pub sessions. I know a few E.g. Walter Bulwers 1 and 2 but not as many pairings as I'd like, and it's always disappointing if you play a tune and don't follow it up with at least one more. And a lot of books don't pair them (some do, I know ... but a lot don't)  and I have couple of PDFs of Irish sets but...I still can't play an Irish reel at full speed on a DG... so suggestions plz!

[nigelr]

If you search Google for Duke of Wellington Tune Book there is a PDF that has a long list of 2 tune sets with dots. N

[brianread]

http://www.cpartington.plus.com/Session%20Tunes/The%20Duke%20of%20Wellington%20Tune%20Book%202nd%20Edtion.pdf

[Steve_freereeder]

I will post this and then run for my coat. 
http://www.johnkirkpatrick.co.uk/wr_MedleyMania.asp

[Lester]

Here's my current aide-memoire

Auvergne Polka 2 - La Schottische
Barren Rocks of Aden - March of St Timothy
Brighton Camp - March Past
Charles Lynch's Waltz - En Avant Blonde
Dark Island - Arran Boat
Down the Road - Walter Bulwer’s No 3
E Minor Set
Emma - Avant Blonde
Harper's Frolic - Bonny Kate   
Ganivelle - Canal in October
George Green - Steamboat
Harpers Frolic - Bonny Kate
Highland Cathedral - Old Grenadier
Hunting the Hare Jig/Reel
Jan Mijne Man - Cochin Chine
John of Paris - Oscar Woods
Jimmy Allen - Salmon Tails
Kafuzalum - Keel Row
Lunch at the Pub - LNB Polka
Marche des Cab... - Dennis Crowther's
Michael Turner's Waltz - Fanny Power
Mona's Delight – Cochin Chine
Mickey Mouse – Redwing – In the Toyshop – You are My Sunshine – Nickelodeon
Mudgee Waltz - Rope Waltz
Night to Morn - Mount Hills
Oats Peas Beans - When Daylight Shines
Papadum Polka – Trip to Fleetwood
Rochdale - Bacup
Rogue's March - Captain Lanoe's
Schottische a Bethanie - Plane Tree
Sir John Fenwick - Sir Sidney Smith
South Downs Jig - Linnen Hall
Sussex Cotillion - Old Mother Oxford
Uncle Bernard's Polka - Grandfather's Tune
Upton on Severn Hankie & Stick
Wheatley Trunkles - Processional
When Cloe - Ville de Quebec   
William Taylor's - Theme Vannitaise
Winster Gallop - Davy Davy - Uncle Bernard's

[Lester]

I will post this and then run for my coat. 
http://www.johnkirkpatrick.co.uk/wr_MedleyMania.asp

An interesting read but not helpful to the question asked

[Steve_freereeder]

I will post this and then run for my coat. 
http://www.johnkirkpatrick.co.uk/wr_MedleyMania.asp

An interesting read but not helpful to the question asked

Which is perhaps why I went for my coat.

But seriously, although some people find it contentious, it is an interesting read and one which crystalised much thought and made a lot of sense to me. I am mostly of the same mind as JK. I don't particularly like putting tunes together, although I often will do it in sessions, as it seems to be the expected thing. I draw the line at more than two tunes in a set though. The tunes should stand by themselves, at least if the player is good enough to inject life into them with melodic, rhythmic and harmonic vitality. In my ceilidh band it's nearly always one tune for each dance.

[Tone Dumb Greg]

...an interesting read and one which crystalised much thought and made a lot of sense to me.

Thanks for that Steve. I think that's just where I would like to go next, if I can manage it.

[jonm]

If you are leading a medley of tunes in a session, it works well to have the more familiar tune (which more people can join in with) as the second tune. You will need to call the change and provide a strong lead into the second tune. More people will notice if you fluff the start than will spot you stopping playing the previous tune early (letting the rest continue) to call the change and be ready to go.

[Mike Carney]

It's good to hear all the inputs on this. I know it has surfaced before, including the JK article. Roger did ask for pairs to play in an English session so i think it is good to give suggestions. Thanks to Lester for his sharing of his own sets. I will have a good look at these tune names as there many that I haven't had a go at yet. I was also interested to get the tunebook link which is great. Again stashed!

Thinking about my own experience of various sessions I am more likely not to pair tunes, not because I can't think of a pairing but because of the desire to play just that tune, which I have picked because I really like it. When you are in a big session and you are only going to get a couple of choices all evening you also  tend to choose carefully and feel a little under pressure not to take up more than your fair share of time. Pairings that I have adopted and which I would start in a session have been ones that really stood out and captivated me.

I tend to agree quite a lot with the JK angle but perhaps not as extreme a position. It does match very much  what I have felt when playing and dancing to French tunes.
M

[Rog]

Thanks! Just what I was hoping for. I play at a couple of sessions and, being a JK fan, sometimes play a couple of his sets (We Will Down With The French...etc being a personal favourite) but I almost always get blank looks and comments like ... those tunes are a bit mangled... because JK (it seems) has introduced/composed variations which are repeated in his books, and anyone not familiar with his music will wonder what is happening. In the ceilidh band I occasionally play with, we play 2 or 3 tune sets, with the same time sig (obviously), for each dance. In sessions it gets a bit repetitious if only one tune is played..and musicians expect at least two with the 'change' bellowed, or leg lifted to indicate when the change occurs. Hence my question, and the great responses. And a merry Christmas to you all 

[Lester]

If you are ever in Lewes or its environs

Lewes Tune Book

Lewes Normal Sets

[Lester]

And if you want an odd set there's my Emin set

Uttoxeter Swing
Old Wife of Coverdale
Theme Vanitaise
Bear Dance
Constant Billy (TVMM Version for Sherborne)

All available on my blog.

[playandteach]

Obviously this isn't an area I know much about, but I know that David Oliver likes as a rough guide to have the two tunes in different keys, as it gives a lift. He does of course have exceptions in his sets, but I can see his general point.

[george garside]

I am not over keen on 3or more tune sets being played in sessions  as it can occasionaly result in some clever sod droning on for ever playin , sometimes badly, tunes  few others may be able to or wish to join in with.  If possible a session 'norm' of not more than two tunes  per person starting gives everybody a chance and prevents  the aforementioned   from happening.

I  like Dave Olivers  general principle of two tunes with a key change as being about right    and  in order to obtain this I sometimes play one or other in other than its common key  eg  caddam wood in G followed by La russe in D. which for many will cover the range in for many 'DG' land.   It is however worth remembering   that many sets in D and A are doable on a 2 row DG box  and with chin end accidentals  the bluebell polka can be played in its correct keys of GDC rather than going back to G for the third part.

george

 

[Thrupenny Bit]

Herbert the Sherbert/ The Plane Tree
Dr Fausters/Prince William
Tiptop Hornpipe/Polka
Sussex Bonney Breat Knot/ Double Lead Through

Are all standards down here. We tend to enjoy the tunes for as long as, then change given a shout. Definitely not 2 times through and change, unless someone introduces a new tune that becomes a solo!
cheers
Q

[IanD]

Bearing in mind that you're playing for a session -- where people are listening and/or playing -- not a dance (e.g. a great 16 bar tune played 17 times through with variations for Notty Swing...), I'd certainly say that one or two tunes is usually best. What's certain is that if they're good enough to be played, they're good enough to be played *at least* four times through, and many tunes can/should be played more than this if they're going well and the session is getting "stuck in" to them -- no good tune deserves playing only 3 times, or even less in the old style Scots tradition.

In which case more than two tunes (if 32 or 48 bars) makes for a very long set which can also lead to it seeming that some people are monopolising the session.

And some tunes are so good they can be played a lot more times through even in a session and don't need anything to pair with them -- the same applies to playing for dancing.

A possible exception is comedy sets of tunes that go together and are only played 2 or 3 times each, a couple of which have been mentioned...

[Thrupenny Bit]

'Zackly! Thanks Ian.
Q

[george garside]

''session sets'' or indeed individual tunes  and who knows them varies thoughout the country  .  When running session at Whitby I only had to mention 'Roxburgh castle'  and most of those present were playing it with gusto!.   The first time I led a large session at Sidmouth  I said something on the lines of  how about  'roxbugh castle' and without waiting for a response started it  - very few were able to join in!

There also seems to be  distinct differences in  playing  'english' session tunes in different parts of the country. eg in the north east  the playing is lively (exept for slow aires!) with great rhythm and bounce  , in the midlands it is parhaps a bit more smooth twee, in norfolk is has a lovely laid back feel a la Tony Hall  whilst in the South West the bounce and rhythm is more akin to the north east style.

Similarly there seems to be a variation on what constitutes an ''english session'' tune.  and I have never quite got the hang of whether it is a session of tunes composed or thought up in england   or whether is is merely a term for tunes, be they english, scottish, irish, french or whatever that  just happen to be part of the regular repertoire of a session that happens to be taking place in england!  Personally I prefer the latter description

george

[IanD]

''session sets'' or indeed individual tunes  and who knows them varies thoughout the country  .  When running session at Whitby I only had to mention 'Roxburgh castle'  and most of those present were playing it with gusto!.   The first time I led a large session at Sidmouth  I said something on the lines of  how about  'roxbugh castle' and without waiting for a response started it  - very few were able to join in!

There also seems to be  distinct differences in  playing  'english' session tunes in different parts of the country. eg in the north east  the playing is lively (exept for slow aires!) with great rhythm and bounce  , in the midlands it is parhaps a bit more smooth twee, in norfolk is has a lovely laid back feel a la Tony Hall  whilst in the South West the bounce and rhythm is more akin to the north east style.

Similarly there seems to be a variation on what constitutes an ''english session'' tune.  and I have never quite got the hang of whether it is a session of tunes composed or thought up in england   or whether is is merely a term for tunes, be they english, scottish, irish, french or whatever that  just happen to be part of the regular repertoire of a session that happens to be taking place in england!  Personally I prefer the latter description

george

What "English session" usually means is "not Irish" -- English tunes are great, as are ones from Scotland and Wales, also Italy, Spitaly, Germany, France and Spain (mumming reference), but not wall-to-wall identikit diddly-diddly Irish tunes played by people -- usually English -- who don't understand them, often play far too fast and with no life, and will take over a session with them played back-to-back given half a chance. This is the background behind the "no Irish tunes" rule at the Radway in Sidmouth...

Don't get me wrong, Irish tunes played by people who understand them and play them with feeling and sensitivity (and often a lot slower, and with a lot more oomph, like they were once dance tunes...) are brilliant -- but the genre has been sadly tarnished by players who don't get any of this and just churn out wall-to-wall dross learned from a book with a thousand tunes in, most of them boring and built from the same few note sequences bolted together, and played by people who often think faster is automatically better.

Maybe you could say the same for other tune traditions, but Irish tunes seem to suffer from this problem particularly badly... :-(